I’ll Just Leave the Country and Pay Nothing!

DSC01152_2 (2)_2One of the most common threats a lawyer may hear from a beleaguered client is the cry that “I might as well quit work, if I have to pay that much to my ex-wife”. Another is “I’ll just leave the country and then he/she will get nothing.”

Usually these threats are spoken out of frustration and rarely are they acted upon, however, from time to time a parent will abandon his or her family, rather than obey a court order that is perceived by them to be onerous and unfair.

In a recent Ontario case, Hans Mills did just that. He left the country to avoid paying his ex-wife, Donna Mills, spousal and child support of $3772.00 per month, $2235.00 for the children and $1537.00 for his wife.

A very bleak situation for Ms. Mills who is caring for a 10-year-old with cancer in remission, a Downs Syndrome 14-year-old, a depressed teen, age 17, and a 19-year-old son on methadone treatment. How did everything go so wrong?

After separating in 2005, the Mills reached an agreement in 2008 which gave Ms. Mills sole custody of the children, and the family home, valued at $1.2 million (with a $600,000 mortgage), in exchange for a payment to Mr. Mills of $175,000. Because she received the lion’s share of the equity in the home, she agreed to forego spousal support. Mr. Mills earned approximately $100,000 per year and would pay child support.

Three years after their agreement, money issues began to simmer and a trial was scheduled to deal with the problems that had arisen, including Ms. Mill’s alleged inability to work. In an interim application before the trial, the Court ordered Mr. Mills to pay his ex-wife spousal support, including retroactive support and court costs, in spite of the fact that she had received two-thirds of the family home.

Recognizing that the interim order was a precursor to worse things to come, Mr. Mills sold his house, cashed in his pension, paid his bills, and moved to the Philippines, a country where he had done business for years and a country that had no support treaty with Ontario.

Ms. Mills had always feared he would just leave and implored the government agency that collects child and spousal support to register a lien against his house and seize his Canadian and European passports, but to no avail. And then he was gone. His email to his ex-wife read:

“The result of the legal instrument which you recently designed and implemented
is that there is no possibility of a comfortable life or a (secure) retirement for me in
Canada at all. Therefore, I have left the country to seek greener pastures elsewhere
and will never return. Well done Einstein. Good luck and good bye.”

Ms. Mills is perilously close to financial, emotional, physical, and spiritual bankruptcy, but says she will not let her children down, despite the dire circumstances.

As for “Father of the Year”, his actions are despicable. His departure was fueled by a court order to pay spousal support, which he now uses to justify his decision to stop supporting his children. He has expressed hope that one day he can reconcile with his children, “but not in Canada, a morally bankrupt state”.

It is Hans Mills that is “morally bankrupt”.

Lawdiva aka Georgialee Lang

268 thoughts on “I’ll Just Leave the Country and Pay Nothing!

  1. I had a similar case of international flight. A woman came to me wanting advocacy assistance, as her ex-husband had gone to a foreign jurisdiction, to avoid the financial consequences of divorce Court Orders. She bought in all her documents…a box full. After a careful read, I empathized with the dad, as he had been unfairly dealt with by the Courts, even after appeal. So being a professional man and very smart, he decided to exercise a desperate option, and reestablish his career elsewhere, by leaving the country as a last resort. He never abandoned his kids, and did his best to stay in contact, over the obstruction of the mother. He bought the kids things directly, so that mother could not get her hands on money. He paid for holidays etc. He was determined not to put money into the hands of his ex-wife. Upon review of the Court material, it was clear that the father tried to make the best out of a no-win situation. It was his recourse in response to the Appeal Courts and the biased Family Law system that was subject to manipulation by the mother (and her lawyer). The documents revealed that the Courts were unwilling to see how it was manipulated, and that there were other ways of looking at the best interest of children and created dependency. It was a rare case, but it opened my eyes to how the system had been used for malevolent objectives. Even after years of loosing, the mother was still headstrong in not accepting the reality of the sad situation, and she still wanted revenge and further litigation. By the time the mother came to see me for help, one child had matured and moved out on their own, and established a normal but geographically distant relationship with the father, and had disconnected from the mother. The family lost about a million, through legal fees and mortgage foreclosure etc. Because the father was a medical professional, he could quickly move and re-establish himself. Many fathers do not have these options when they cannot pay for competent legal representation, and the taxpayer funds the other side with a seemingly bottomless pit of litigators.

  2. Im in the situation where I paid a sh-itload of money to my ex (virtually all over our liquid savings) she then went after me in the courts to pay child support and am now paying 70,000 yen a month (around $US900) and currently that eats up a third of my part time take home salary. Come January it will be closer to 4/5ths. Court is not amenable to reducing payments as they decided thats what I can afford. Unlike the above guy I can no simply disappear overseas.

  3. Dear Georgialee,

    He made 100k a year in Canada which leaves him with 53,000.

    He was shelling out most of that to child support ( not tax deductible ) leaving him with very little to even pay rent let alone live.

    And you think HE is morally bankrupt? Are you on Crack? The judge, lawyers, and the wife should all lose their licenses and be jailed for what they have done to that poor man. You should be ashamed of yourself for even thinking he is a deadbeat dad.

    She was a greedy lazy woman who used the system to cripple her husband and destroy his life and his kids lives. Men don’t leave the country to avoid paying reasonable support, which the tables currently are garbage and unreasonable. They leave or commit suicide from these types of decisions. Yet where are you with that? As of 2010 there was 2.5 BILLION in unpaid support, most likely because guess what, the Dad or mom can’t afford it. Darrin White committed suicide after he was ordered to pay twice his income to his wife.

    Ms. Mills deserves everything she gets. She should have been smart and learned the old axiom, you can shear a sheep many times but you can only skin em once. Now she is paying dearly for her laziness and stupidity.

    The fact that you think she is the victim here is the BIGGEST joke of all.

    • Completely agree with you. The system
      In Canada is absolutely ridiculous and geared towards lazy woman. There should be a legal document that a couple signs that if a woman wants to keep a child and the father wants nothing to do with it, the woman should be completely responsible. The current laws just make it possible for useless wh***s to sleep with tons of guys and have several kids to be used as a source of income instead of working like a normal person.

      • Same in New Zealand,I’m so depressed I’ve been thinking about killing my self for the last 7 years.It’s not right to destroy a man from falsely claimed moral high ground,impoverish him,reduce his ability to be his kid’s hero,removing his ability to provide for his family and destroying his self worth.I have grieved for myself and my son who I would have ideally had grown up with siblings and a solid family unit.The woman always new I did not want to have children because of my fearful childhood,OF WHICH was not ever brought into our relationship or my sons.When she told me she was pregnant she barricaded herself behind furniture like a naughty child,I think she thought this would make me snap,I just cried and tried to pretend I was happy and said that I would support her no matter what.She replied that I don’t have to be named,it doesn’t have to be mine.I tried to have an honest go of things,bought everything for a household,family car and it wiped out my deposit on a house.
        He was conceived after we had split up out of what I perceive as spite and selfishness on her part and poor judgement on mine.I love my son more than my life which is also probably the only thing keeping me going…his right to a dad who loves him.These days though I wonder what negative influence or use an anxious,depressed father has.

        I am now 32 years old and on a sickness benefit that just sustains me,my anxiety is like the fear of death,it makes me feel sick and I see no hope.I was a responsible person who worked hard,10 years paying my taxes as a Plumber and 3 years as a soldier, a few others during my teens.I now have nothing and frequently feel demolished and hopeless at any future that fixes anything.

        Child support makes it possible for career Welfare Mums to exist,it also enslaves honourable fathers doing the best they can.I Sometime’s wish that maybe the state kept out of it and that the woman’s family would have to support her first so that she would be accountable for her actions it would also have inherent other benefits like her being answerable to someone for her action’s(not bringing strange men home,drugs/alcohol) and her parents footing the bill for the negative aspect’s of her upbringing.Also if the father doesn’t want to support his child he probably shouldn’t be around the child and this would be a self governing arrangement.The woman who failed her relationship would have at least brought the child into an example of a relationship that works with both a good male and female roll model and have 3 times the adult support instead of one part time mum and daycare.
        Aside from reality not being that utopian you could at least have a case by case support arrangement instead of society freely working to degrade it’s self in guaranteed career welfare checks.Giving all the power of your self determination to the state is giving up on life and leeching off other’s even if you deserve a break hard done by legitimate “school of hard knocks” women.

        I’m considering leaving the country for good in pursuit of a meaningful life of prosperity and self determination so as to make something of my self,perhaps become a roll model that does not let a slavery law dictate how far he can rise in life.With tax and child support half of what I would earn of not much at all,for my education and Current Health more over is about the same as being a sickness beneficiary of the state.For the past 4 years I have thought it would be an impossible catch 22 to leave my son for a career offshore that made me independent financially but heartbroken and guilty for not trying to be there for my son.I have a rage inside me that turns to tears.

        If I was to leave what countries would be best as far as having no agreements with my home government in New Zealand.

      • I would totally leave the country if I were you. Some may think that being born in a country like Mexico is unfortunate, but I’ve found out it has huge advantages, such as the government doesn’t give a s$#% about you and so they also can’t enforce anything on you. I haven’t paid taxes in 10 years, actually I haven’t paid taxes ever! and that’s because most taxes just end up in the president’s new home or plane, etc. Also if I marry and get divorced there’s little enforcement the government could do on me and people don’t take things to court as they know it is useless.

        But, if I were in your situation, I would totally move to another country. It is totally possible, in fact, I’m currently living in the Czech Republic, I work as a translator online and found out it is easy to get long term visas here for 2 years and renewable, so it is totally legal, what’s more, there are many English speaking expats who can legally get permits to teach English. $530 USD per month get me my own apartment with utilities and internet. Food expenses are less than $400 including dinning out most of the time. I make about $2000 per month on my freelance so the rest is just savings and traveling and enjoying life.

        You can also get away with this life in Mexico (and get an apartment by the beach), Thailand, Phillipines, Indonesia, etc. Like they mentioned, not paying alimony is not a crime, but it would fup you credit, but at least you can get a good life anywhere else. You already know the system is broken, in fact, it has changed little since the times of Hammurabi’s code, from which is based.

        Just remember that your ex is now probably banging other guy and living off alimony while you can’t get a new girl since English speaking cultures put women in a pedestal and the men there always act desperate plus they have unrealistic expectations and now that you’re broke they wont like you.

        The good news is that in the countries I mentioned it is so easy to meet women, and that’s one of the reasons why I moved here. Everything is possible, just figure how to get a job in another country or do the online freelance. Cheers.

    • Agree with Tebsen 110% It’s time for the family court system to be flushed out and all divorce attorney and judges pay the fathers for the rest of their stupid lives.

    • I agree……..The Court should not leave a person destitute! Shame on them! BUT,……….The man SHOULD definitely, ON HIS OWN, be sending money to his ex wife for their children! The Court should NOT have to tell him this! He should WANT to do it! They ARE his kids, she is taking care of them and there is no reason in the world he should not be, sending them money each month to help pay for their food, shelter, electricity they use, clothing, medical insurance, etc. It IS despicable IF he is NOT sending money each month to them. He should keep copies of the canceled checks as proof of he is helping to support his children. IF he is not sending support money for his children, he SHOULD be ashamed of himself!

      • Let’s review. He paid $775,000 in home equity and cash, plus $45,000 a year in child support for three years for a total of $910,000 AFTER TAX dollars! That is enough to last at least 30 years, or more, if you ditch the mansion and live at the median family income level. Plus, she was making $100,000/year for three years until she mysteriously couldn’t work anymore. I guess you are arguing he should still pay the $45,000/year voluntarily, but you should be able to see that it’s just to fund her extravagant lifestyle, and not that the kids will go hungry. I’ve known plenty of guys who pay child support, and the courts apparently expect the guys to work to pay, and then go home to watch TV because there isn’t money left for anything else. It’s just like being in jail.

      • So stupid. I’m a 31 year old man with who makes at most 30 k. My ex always made more money and when my son was born had insurance. She quickly left her job dropped his and her insurance took a crap job with no benefits and a huge pay cut. Than She left me. Took me to court for full custody. I argued for 50 50 shared since I don’t make alot of money and in fact love my son. Now I have joint custody and get to see my son 8 days a month. She gets half my pay and seeks assistance through the state. She by the way never wanted our son. I talked her out of having an abortion and took care of my son until she upped and left. Now I have no life and should I not be able to pay I will surely have my right to my son taken away and probably be locked up. This is the United States! All the best to the Man/Father who who got away from this bullshit. Shame on those who thinks this is fair.

      • You’re a jack—-. The only reason she fought so hard to keep the kids away from her husband is so that she could collect and live off of the child support that the father has to pay.

    • Exactly, finally someone understands… The whole child support spousal support system is bullshit. It’s legalized extortion and it’s not fair at all… I work 2 jobs and I still can’t survive because of child support… And I was entrapped… But yet I have to pay over 900 per month… I can’t even afford to heat my home or put food in my house… I begged DHS to please stop taking so much because I can’t afford it, so they lowered it by 10 dollars…. F—– leaches… This has forced me in a very dark place mentally. I have no life, I’m exhausted from working so much, and still can’t make ends meet… I really could use some help… I am literally at the end of my rope. I’ve contemplated suicide several times, leaving the country, or just buying a new identity. But not sure how to do it… Suicide might be the only way out for me the way things are looking… I just don’t know what to do anymore… I make 8 dollars an hour at one job, and 10 an hour at my second job… I have a 355.00 car payment a month, 400.00 for rent every month, 127.00 for my phone, 100.00 per week for heat, 50.00 per week for hot water and gas stove, 141.00 for insurance per month, 50.00 per week for gas in my car to get back and forth to work… So yea, no money for food, and if I do buy food, I have to go a week without heat in my house, and it’s winter time… I’m just out of ideas… If anyone has any info to a solution, can someone please call me and let me know or email me at andyhackett82@yahoo.com I could use any info I can get

      • To EhterTheHumanRace,

        Thanks for sharing your very moving story. Good luck. I suggest to “walk away”. I knew someone in similar circumstances who chose to give up everything and start afresh. He is much happier now. And, no more “marriage” in the future. Women ok, marriage not ok.

      • Andy,……Don’t give up! If you have proof you are making $8 and $10 an hour and can verify the employment at these two jobs,…..file a motion on your own and ask for child support to be reduced. And show proof of all your monthly bills. Child support is suppose to be set by the income of both parties and the number of children. And you should be made aware as to how they came up with the $900 a month. You should know what your former partner’s income, if any, is.

        However, IF a judge thinks you are capable of bringing in more income, they may not reduce it. On another note, and fairly unrelated to the topic, I would say, you need to rethink your income future irregardless of the children. Do you really think you can live the life you want making $8 and $10 dollars an hour? I would look for higher paying jobs or try to get some training in a field you have an interest in so you can boost your salary, not only to help with child support, but for your own future.

      • Andy I understand your desperation, having worked with dozens of clients who have faced similar problems. How many children are you supporting? Are you paying off arrears of support as well as current support? Does your State use child support guidelines? When was the last time the court reviewed your financial circumstances?

        If you are feeling suicidal please call a help line and get some support…there is light at the end of the tunnel…Georgialee

      • Andy…get the hell out of dodge! the court system is bias. They will not help you in any shape or form! get that through you head! life is too short…btw how do you know that money is going to your ex thug lovers? Theres lots of other places you can move to…people have be moving for years.Plan your exit!

      • I’d leave man. Now I’m not saying dont support your kid. But when you are safely away from the reach of the courts, send what you can. Your kid has to eat, but so do you.

    • Agreed! I read the story, not just what was presented in the one-sided article. He was going to be left destitute without the money to even see his kids, assuming he would be “allowed” to. She hit the lottery on this one and just wanted more.

    • That Current Tab of unpaid Child Support Arrears in Ontario as of 2015 is over 3 Billion now! It will get Higher…Much, Much Higher!

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  6. Your interpretation of the story leaves out several key facts. The man in question was being forced to pay $48,000 a year, despite the fact that, after taxes, he only made $68,000 a year, leaving him working to the bone to live off of $20,000 a year while his wife lives in a $1.2 million dollar mansion with a guest house she can rent for $2,000 a month (more than he makes in a month after support payments). That is slavery, and no decent human being should be subject to it.

    • Why must you burst her emotional bubble of indignation with facts? She had a good witch hunt going and you had to ruin it with the truth.

    • You’d think anyone with half a brain will understand that there is no way a professional can leave and go on with his life like this!!! This is humiliating to see that judges who are supposed to be fair, just, and bilateral can’t get this!!!! Who elects these people? The lawyers who work with them all the time!!! Are they being elected by attorneys to support them after they sit on the bench. I wonder why it’s almost 90% of the fathers who loose all their assets and are left out in the cold in a divorce court? Someone please enlighten me

      • I have read hundreds of BC divorce (division of assets, support) judgments at the BC courthouse libraries. I found less than 10 cases where the men appeared to have received spousal support, and all of those had “fine print”.

        .. as in: “The Big Print giveth, and the Fine Print taketh away.”

      • Here…Let me enlighten you! The Whole Family and Criminal Court System has been infiltrated by the Feminist Agenda. They have virtually everything tilted in favor of Women…and I mean everything! Dads are relegated to being nothing more than Convenient Visitors and Walking ATMs for insufferable Victim Mentality Women. When you look at the Senate Committee and Supreme Court Hearings on various Bills or Laws, you will see who is advocating this nonsense N.O.W. or National Action Committee for the Status of Women. Mens Groups are Silenced or kept from Participating. It is a very Selfish and Tilted Agenda…along with the usual Cultural Marxism that Feminists so like to buy into! Its time for Men to gather and refuse on a grand scale…what amounts to nothing more than a Feminist Ponzi Scheme! A scheme that transfers all the Wealth from Hardworking Men and transfers it to Women, Denies them Equitable Access to their Children…leaving them Heart Broken, Homeless and Suicidal. It is also largely responsible for Post Divorce Violence, Suicide and Murder Suicide! The Courts, Judges and Lawyers are the Real Murderers, and not the Alienated Dads. But of course…They will suggest otherwise! Until Men Organize, Stick Together, Mob Together and Oppose on a Grand Scale…this Systemic Abuse by the System will Continue!!! Better yet. Warn younger Men of the obvious dangers of Marriage and Divorce 2.0 and encourage Men Going Their Own Way (MGTOW) Activism. Refuse to work harder than you have to in order to support yourself leaving a minimalist tax base for them to draw off. Starve the System Legally…and watch how fast things will turn around in the other direction. By 2025…the System will be heading into a Meltdown anyways! Rapid decline of Revenue due to the Retiring and Dying off of the Pre War-Post War Boomers will bring about the certain demise of these Government Run Social Gimmicks…and there will be no more Free Rides!!! Have a Great Day!

  7. Hans Mills is a hero. And Law Diva is a monster, destroyer of families.

    Marriage is done in the West, read the manosphere or Dalrock’s blog to learn how and why “never married” rates are skyrocketing for women.

    • TO MIKE:

      I would not make a bald statment that “LawDiva is a destroyer of families” without at least doing a Canlii.org search on her name, and see what she accomplished in courts.

      Your comment may be unfair to the LawDiva or unfounded.

      Your other point, that women are having a hard time getting a man, is true, according to female friends in BC.

      • From what I saw in Canlii, this is my guesstimate: Ms. Lang does not go “to court” often, and when she does, the issue is complex or novel or worthwhile. If I needed legal advise/help, I would go to her. Kudus, Ms. Lang.

      • Appreciate your interest in this topic. I actually have been in court on hundreds of cases over the last 26 years. Check out the heading “My Cases” on my blog… or Cases on my website georgialeelang.com. I have defended scores of fathers/husbands and taken a lead role in advancing the concept of shared parenting. You can see my cases on the BC Superior Courts website, both in the Court of Appeal and in the trial court BCSC. You need to google GA Lang, G. Lang, Georgialee Lang, to find them all. Cheers! Georgialee

    • Men should just refuse to Marry or Shack Up…They are both the same now anyways! The Golden Vagina Worship needs to stop also!

  8. Young men, read the comments above carefully, and note the one-sided facts presented by this blogger, and the obvious anti-male sentiment… women
    outnumber men in universities, are more readily employable, are treated with favorable bias by the courts, are ineligible for the draft, live 7 years longer, always receive custody of children, and now (in the U.S.) get healthcare subsidized by men… while boys are now basically placed on Ritalin at birth in order to comply with a zero-wiggling tolerance school system employing 90% female teachers…. NEVER, EVER MARRY. My suggestion is to move overseas before they make that illegal too. Notice how the wife in this story tried to seize Mr. Mill’s passports. In another few years they’ll just place them in the custody of a family law judge on your wedding night!

    It’s also sad that the mother has obviously poisoned the minds of her children to hate their father. It’s also obvious that he’s NOT earning a six-figure salary now. Mr. Mills, if you are reading this comment – one day your boys (at least) will understand. Try to keep contact and support them creatively (i.e., without letting your wife get her fingers on your $$) as you can. Send them stuff via Ebay (used – she can’t easily sell).

    NOTE: This woman still has an equity value in her house worth half a million bucks, plus a guaranteed fixed income… plus rental income!!! I have nil sympathy for her economically.

  9. wow…This is insanity..I am a woman going through a divorce and I could never put my ex through this..how is this allowed to happen? What can I do to help? form a group? I want to help get these absorb laws changed..my new boyfriend just got told he has to pay his ex 3300.00 a month..now he has to sell everything and he will still be living below the poverty line. Where is the justice in this?

    • I agree, I am a mother and I pay two bogus support orders. Making 14.42/hr. $30,000/yr. Paying out 440.00 and 580.00 totaling 1,020/mo. being left with 1,287.00/mo. How do I live off of this without stressing and becoming ill? Now, with having to venture out to hopefully find a second job…I will be able to see my babies. I had to move from NJ to FL to be able to live. With living with fibromyalgia and not trying to be so stressed is a challenge. I am currently unemployed actively looking for work and my license is suspended due to failure to pay Nov and Dec. I can’t get to my imterviews to get a job. While I am unemployed, I still have arrears adding up.
      I was feeling this way:Judical system needs a face lift. Their laws and processes aren’t for the people. Everything that is done…the state is getting paid!!!!!
      So many cases are heard, but not listened to.
      $$$$$ rules.. truth drools!! Common sense is no longer used.
      This is heavy on me.. if they’re people out their that have been screwed or is still being screwed by the Non-Justice system… let our voices be heard! Let’s start a petition to over turn laws that existed since the 70’s. Our country is changing, so shall our laws and processes.
      If you or someone you know has been wronged by such, let’s start to change it!
      This is a democratic country right?!!!
      “One has not only legal, but a moral responsibility to obey just laws. Conversely, 1 has a moral responsibilty to disobey unjust laws” Martin Luther King Jr.

    • It is great that we read 1-2 replies from compassionate ethical women, that helps us restore faith in Humanity. I think we should spread the word more often, and women should speak out against the alimony stuff. I support women empowerment. And this spousal support is just making women into useless leeches instead of getting on their own feet.

    • Continue to do what you always have. Be Fair and Be Reasonable and do not let your Feelz go past your Sensibilities!

  10. This is exactly my case, I just left the country to avoid paying my cheating ex-wife an amount of $4700 / month, where I was making around 6K.
    After I found that my ex had been cheating on me for years, I filed for a divorce and unfortunately was ordered by court to pay my ex an amount of $1200 for child support, and an amount of 3400 for alimony, and all of my ex attorney fees.
    I did not mind paying the child support..

    But the alimony? really Mr. Judge !! what did you want me to pay it for? A reward for her cheating ?

    Thank you No-Fault divorce law. Thank you for never considering cheating as a divorce fault, thank you for such corrupt law, you ruined my life, and my child’s life..
    I had no option but to keep some dignity and break the law by transferring all of my money, quitting my job and running away ..

    Now that I left the country, I’ll never be coming back, will get married again, will keep waiting for the day till I meet with my child , and will save every penny for the child support till that day ..

    • I advocate for tearing up our Charter of Rights and Freedoms Act. In my opinion it is so misused. How many lawyers will drag out their client’s case over years, and then ask the court to dismiss the case because it has taken too long to get to trial? This is not the case for all lawyers, so ethical lawyers relax. If lawyers were no longer able to cite the Charter in order to get a case tossed out, then we will have less time needed for trials. The Law Courts will no longer be stretched to the max, and Canadians may save millions and then some.

      I suggest tearing up the Charter because innocent capable citizens who are not a risk to themselves or others in BC have no chance to defend themselves without being afforded the same rights as criminals when detained/arrested under BC’s Mental Health Act Section 28(1). When citizens are denied their Charter Rights and call to family before being drugged and committed, we all need to take another hard look at the Charter and how it’s being used or abused!

    • I’m sorry to hear that you were driven to this. I may have to do the same or wind up in jail as a dead beat dad. And I love how we are legally bound not to tell the children the truth about what’s going on.

      • Dear Skrood; you have my sympathy and I share your pain. Unfortunately, the broken feminist system has hired old trailer trashes who have been abused or misused as social workers. These misguided people are leading and providing advise to our children!!! I wonder who and how these people get qualified and what’s the over-site process for controlling these people. My Ex showed up in court with of these goons, checking me out and providing her with advise!!! I left the country and broke the slavery chain. It’s time for the court system to wake up and smell the roses as more and more men are standing up to the corrupt judges and attorneys. It’s time to post the name of these judges who have become a hindrance in the justice system instead of public servant. It’s time for them to understand it’s the same people who put them there in the first place they are wrongfully and prejudicially. The judge who had a tendency to make a lot of mistake in my case, after giving almost all my assets to the ex and giving full custody of my children with “limited visitation” what ever the @#$# that means, would not even agree to have a hearing on support modification!!!! Tell me that’s not prejudice and unfair. If I learned one thing through 6 years of my divorce ordeal, is that, the family court is run by feminist and men have no rights. Lets get together and start a coalition to fix the system, judges, attorneys, and greedy women who fall in their trap. God bless.

    • TO M1: Why do you say you “broke the law”?

      If you have no job, you can’t pay, that’s all. Nobody, even a judge, can get blood from a rock.

    • Well I would send the child support. I’m not saying the amount the judge said, but the kids need something. I agree with leaving and hell no to paying alimony.

      • To: Kerry
        Hey, Watch your mouth moron. If you think you can curse, I can as well and in a way much better than you, but i don’t.
        I still tried all possible ways you can think of to communicate with my child; including proposing sending decent amount of money for child support, but all my trials were rejected.

        The cheating greedy ex is not (and will never be) satisfied and she poisoning the child brain with false facts.
        I do cry tears of blood for my child, but i didn’t and still don’t have any other options available.

        What would you do ? Live on the street and act as ATM slave for the rest of your live?
        I cannot wish nothing more right now but for you to live in this position one day and for you to to face what i have already faced ..

      • I’ll back you on that one M1. That’s pretty much the exact situation that I find myself in now! I really get a kick out of how all these “Simp Men” who are completely Brainwashed, can jump on here and belittle the good number of Men who have been categorically abused by the System and brought to financial ruin! I laugh at these types when I find out that its happened to them. That is about a dozen times now…and the look of shock and dismay on their faces are a sight to behold. Best Part…these idiot’s think they have any Real Right’s? They quickly find out how that all gets shoved aside in Family Courts and False Domestic Violence Charges. Too many times that I have had to say “I told you so”

  11. DAMN Your Court – I Will NOT PAY Child Support
    Let’s face it… when you get divorced, you, as the father, or the wife or girlfriend of a victim of the family court siytem and evil women, are probably not going to see the children, and if you do, it will be rarely and on the ex’s terms… why fight it? Win by not participating. Damn United States Courts. Liquidize if you have 401K’s and start over somwhere else where you don’t have to suuport your ex, because if it was about child support and the children, they’d a.) split custody with you, and b.) pay their own half while you pay yours, but that isn’t what they want. Document any communications to show youir children that their mothers are evil and that you do love them. With any luck, the mother will die old and alone and they’ll have deserved every bit of it, while you reconcile and spend time that you were deprived of together as a father and child, in another country.
    These days, I work for the government in a country that does not have a child support treaty with the US. I haven’t seen my little girl in more than five years, nor has her mother, because her mother abandoned her in Russia, and the courts still sided with her, using unproven allegations of abuse. That was all it took, and unsubstantiated allegation. My ex still isn’t with my little girl.

    If you’re a man, the worst thing you can do is pay child support, because it only drives feminist lawyers like the author, the courts, the government, and the evil women that do this, incentive to continue. They’ve already taken what is most important, us from our children, and our children from us, and if we pay, we only continue the cycle and show them that they can get away with it for others.
    Many of us men, were the sole breadwinner for years, with wives that refused to work, even if we begged them to, because they knew they would be rewarded for not working, only at the end, to have them try to shame us (as the author attempted to do – “Father of the Year, not”)… I proudly stand in contempt of court. I live in poverty in a country not of my birth, haven’t seen my child in so long, and I’ll not live in their chains. Never settle for anything less than 50 percent custody, and NO support exchanged, because they all make money off of it. Equal rights, equal responsibility, which means, that women, even with abortions, adoptions, birth control pills, which exist for men, but they won’t legalize, legal abandonment programs, and winning custody at a rate of 12 to 1, is already more than equal. They can pay their half of the support. We men don’t get any of the “equalities” afforded to women. I’ll burn in hell before I pay for her and the government.
    Proudly in defiance. Join us on facebook at Damn Your Court, I Will Not Pay Child Support, or on our new page, Coalition to End Child Support. You are NOT their slave, no matter what they tell you.

  12. I’m extrеmely impгessed ѡith your writing abilities. Keep up tҺe еxcellent quality writing, it’s rаre to
    see а great blog like this one these daуs..

  13. Wow. This can’t be real. Do people actually do things like this in real life? I don’t believe this article. I don’t believe a father with (special needs) kids would leave his country to avoid paying child support. This article is not true. No one does that.

    • Unfortunately, they do….very few, however. I know of at least three who retained me to help them “come home”, a process of negotiating arrears of support and other terms to avoid contempt findings and jail, in some cases.

      • Ac says:
        February 27, 2015 at 7:10 AM
        Lol….he really had no choice…are you people serious?


        No kidding, I have to shake my head at the fact that this lawyer can’t see logic, this is sad, mgtow s getting bigger and bigger and this is the reason

    • This Article and completely True! I will only say that you are extremely Naive and Uninformed. This Item that the Author mentions, was in the Hamilton Spectator and Toronto Star. The couple involved lived on a Lakefront Property in Burlington,Ontario. The Man had to flee to the Philippines in order to save whatever was left of his hide! Can’t say I blame him. Wish I could do the same!

    • Bad New…Yes it does happen! It gets more Common and Worse every year. Men are often forced to Go to Jail, Quit Life-Suicide, Leave the Country or live off the Grid or on the Streets. Don’t be so Naive!

  14. After reading full the page, I agree that province laws in Canada are in favor of women. It is ridiculous laws been enforced, that badly effect living standards. sometimes, I have to live in Canada where every thing is expansive, higher taxes, long waiting time in hospitals, over competition in jobs, immigration flooding, over stressed laws, matrimonial homes, divorces complications, lawyers rip off, not higher wages/increments, and several others. Over all, strongly suggest to amend family laws/enforcement laws.

  15. There are obviously lawyers making comments on this page. Why is it that no one commented on the illegality of taking away a Canadian mans passport to prevent him from leaving Canada? Our Charter of Rights and Freedoms guarantees us the right to enter Canada and leave Canada. When I divorced I gave away freely the house and furniture. I never even hired a lawyer. When the ex-wife mentioned alimony I said I would leave Canada and go to a country with no treaty with Canada. (I have lived abroad before and this was no idle threat) But first I would hire a lawyer and fight. I suggested she call what she got a win. Fortunately she did. We had no kids so no alimony. I considered myself lucky to just be losing everything. That’s a win. Most of my friends who divorce lose everything they have and everything they ever will have. Our constitutional rights trump this female extortion racket and any good lawyer should defend that. I think that these mercenary Canadian ladies should consider this small fact. Even if they take away a mans passport there is a lot of Canadian wilderness to live in. On principle I would go there rather than be forced to pay anyone. Involuntary servitude is a crime against humanity. It’s a form of slavery. It does not matter that our corrupt system promotes this. The German legal system supported what they did too, but the “good Nazi” defense did not hold up at the Nuremberg trials. There is no statute of limitations on crimes against humanity.
    A man only needs to share his food and his fire with people who choose to live with him.

    • RE: “Most of my friends who divorce lose everything they have and everything they ever will have”

      That’s probably because they hired a lawyer,

      Look at this case:


      The wife, who is not young, has spent upwards of $1.2M already, and the asset fight has merely moved into commercial courts, because there are corporate marriage assets.

      Her husband, and children, are also in the legal war.

      Bottom line: They will be unhappy for years.

      My suggestion to Ron: Don’t hire a lawyer, don’t go to court, if you can. You cannot have a war unless the soldiers attend it.


    • Which is pretty much what I intend to do…Go really deep into the Bush. I have already been Homeless and living under a Makeshift Lean-to Shelter all through the last Winter…no thanks to FRO suspending my Trucking License before I could get my Case back into Court. They did not even follow their own Rules…like a 30 Day Pre-Warning before Suspension. I am drowning in Debt because of her thievery, Wrongfully Convicted and had my Home Stolen out from under me…while she had me thrown in the slammer on a False Breach Charge. Then had her scuzzy Lawyer push through Conditions in a Default Settlement. She will not get a Nickle until she goes back and recants all the BS that she had me Convicted with…All of it! That includes the BS Plea Bargains I was forced to accept under duress! I want Fair and Equitable Access to my Children. I am not paying for an Older Daughter who has been refusing to go to School since she was 15. I also want my Hunting Privilege back, and that BS Criminal Record EXPUNGED! Until that happens…NOTHING! Do not even care if they throw me in Jail for 180 Days,Weeks or Months. She wanted to be dishonest and dirty instead of fair and reasonable…this is what she deserves. NOTHING!

  16. Our feminist dictatoship hurts women by ruining men, because all women depend on exploitation of men. Everything around us was built and invented by men, women did not put one brick. The only way to increase exploitation of men is to increase productivity of men. But, feminists and collaborators decrease productivity of men. Feminists are anti-men, not pro-women. Feminists would ruin 2 women to ruin 1 man. TS

  17. I left the U.S. more than five years ago and have secured second citizenship. I will never go back to the U.S. I will never see my children again. I had a standard boilerplate divorce with false charges, threats of jail, ruinous support demands, and the loss of everything I worked for stretching back 15 years. I said “no” and left. Now she’s on welfare and every other public thing only women ever qualify for and of course that’s on my tab as well. Funny thing about unpayable debts though, they don’t get paid. I have a new life, new job, new possibilities and I am happy abroad. I miss my children terribly but I wouldn’t have seen them from jail either and debtors prison is allowable for ‘dead beats’ like myself. Don’t believe anyone who tells you that child support is some moral debt you must pay. It is nothing more than a ransom you are forced to pay at gunpoint to someone who forbids you from seeing your own children. It is no different than kidnapping with state enforced payments.

    I’m sure my ex now enjoys her “independence” working, starving, scraping by because she tried to enslave someone and the damn slave quit. How morally awful. That slave should be punished. I did 4 years of worry, knowing full well that massa would never forgive an uppity slave who left the plantation without his permission. How dare you not meet cotton quota slave! In what other realm is someone sticking a gun in your face and demanding money declared “moral” oh but we call it child support so *you* are actually the evil one if you can’t meet our demands (and believe me those demands will be very VERY heavy). The west is dying and good riddance. You have labeled good for evil and viciously and mercilessly enforced it. You want me to take care of my children then give them to me – I will love them, support them, feed them, clothe them, and help them as I can but I will not pretend or tolerate your demanding money under penalty of prison and labor camps is the same as love.

    • Who is hurt? The group of victims include father, kids, grandparents, extended family and society. No matter how big is this group, it will always include men and women 50-50. This means that our feminist dictatorship hurts men and women equally. Feminists help destructive woman destroy our society and herself at the end. The misconception that women profit from feminism attracts women and fuels our dictatorship. TS

      • Well said, it’s all a TRAP created by greedy attorneys who add more fuel to fire to create animosity between the poor couples who trust them with their life and all their assets. It’s their bread and butter, you think the court or the attorneys care, who gets hurt!!! The more the merrier. Have you been in your attorney’s office lately, my attorney’s office was a posh corner office in high rent downtown high rise. Ever wonder where they get the money to pay for that? It’s your money! What is the first thing an attorney have you do when you enter their office? To fill out an information sheet, this is to evaluate your (couple’s) financial situation, another word how much money they can make off of you!!! These are the wolves in sheep clothing. The only thing they are interested in is how to prolong the process, increase their billable hours and to fill their own pockets. Yes meanwhile the families are thorn apart while the shameless attorneys are laughing their way to the bank. Of course there are some good attorneys which I have not had a pleasure to meet yet, If there is one who is reading these postings, please stand up and introduce yourselves, because I know a lot of poor divorced fathers who are looking for an honest attorney who has their interest in mind and love to meet a good attorney.
        Attorneys are businessmen or women who work with judges, their boss, on daily basis, their first priority is not to offend or point out the judges mistake at any cost. You’ll rarely find an attorney who will voice your (men’s) interest in front of a judge. If the judge doesn’t like your attorney, you are SOL. Judges usually set up what’s called a conciliation meetings, these meetings are set up to rehearse what the judge will accept to be the outcome of the case shall be. If you really like to know how much weight your attorney will carry ask him to participate in a conciliation meeting, it is your legal right to be present in your own conciliation meetings. The first time you get a hint that a judge is not in tune with you, or your attorney you may want to stop the proceeding and save yourself tons of money in litigation expenses. My best advise for men: do not get involved in this rat race at all and if you do, do not hire an attorney It’s a waste of your hard earned money, first of all. Secondly, nothing frustrates your wife’s attorney more to deal with you directly. This is the worst pain you can inflict on her. There are tons of good books and resources to help you how to deal with your ex’s to be attorney and her.

  18. First off, I have no sympathy for the dog known as Donna Mills. After taxes, unless the man is making 250 k minimum a year, no one can pay 48000 a year, which will only increase because of our shitty
    Law systems. I hate the judges and attorneys involved since they only make the problem worse by getting a cut in every divorce. Since the law obviously favors one side, I’d run too. In fact, if I can’t I’d rather join a corrupt military or become a terrorist than pay for slavery. The only real winners in a divorce are the lawyer, attorneys, feminist groups, and shithead judges. So unless she is missing two hands or legs, get a job. For those hard working women who are dealing with genuinely bad dads, I have no problem wih tier pursuits. For those who want to use support as a meal ticket f you. And for all those who sympathize with this broken system:رایت در جهنم از همه شما!

  19. P.S I am aware of my misspelling of their. Also, let me make this clear Hans Mills is no saint, but its hard to argue why that additional 1500 drove him away after his ex got more than a fair share, including court costs. On a side note, I hope the court does away with the double standards for once and throws the book at Laura Coward. Family laws needs to be restructured to protect children rather than fulfill one’s revenge.

  20. Hello all.
    I make 8.5K per month. she makes 9.5k per month. We have 2 kids. She wants me out of the picture completely and would love if I disappeared completely. My parents have not been allowed to see their Grandchildren ( grandpa is quite ill overseas) because she cannot bear the thought of them playing with them, speaking in a different ethnic language- not to mention holding them.

    She had attacked me several times while I held one of the babies. She wouldn’t let me feed them, kiss them buy before leaving for work- and would not allow them to be bottle fed by me. She would repeatedly accuse me of harassment and that she would call the cops on me for that same reason.

    She took me to court not wanting to negotiate anything. I am now paying75% of my monthly salary as childsupport and have just enough to pay the rent. She has an extra 6000$ left over and is going on spending sprees- looking better than ever. She has a babysitter taking care of the kids from morning till nightfall and does not give much of a shit about them

    The good part in all this is I can see my extended family again and not fear tension around me. It is peaceful and quiet and I can see my children and be the good dad I am. We have a great time together but she tends to be jealous when she sees me involved with them…

    How can I live a life of an indentured financial servant and at the same time fear being alienated from the children. Can I allow for my children to pity me when they grow up ( think that is the best possible scenario if she does not alienate them from me)

    The American Dream was in the palm of my hand and then it slipped away like a jellyfish in the vast blue seas…

    • I want you put your story on one page, with family pics on top, and distribute in public places. Dont mention our feminist dictatorship, just your personal experience. And if you can inspire someone to fight, meet or organize – even better.

  21. Why have a blog if you’re not going to reply to any posts that calls you out, people in the posts make valid points that after you accommodate tax and support the ex husband would have had pennies to live on.

    To me the logical conclusion had I been the judge is that she should sell her house and move into a cheap house rather than squeezing more money out of her ex. If anything the fact that her kids are sick and require additional care implies that the state should step in and support her using the tax money her husband pays into the system.

    • Perhaps a bit of background would assist you. I have advocated for men’s rights in family court for 26 years, often a lone voice amongst my legal colleagues. I have been unafraid to challenge the family law justice system which I say is biased against men. I have spoken and written prolifically on topics including a denunciation of the evils of parental alienation and child abduction, where fathers are typically the victims, and I have been vocal in my support of a presumption of shared parenting. I sympathize with Mr. Mill’s plight in so far as he in good faith negotiated a fair deal that gave his wife the family home in exchange for her waiver of spousal support.

      What I cannot condone, however, is his refusal to pay child support. He brought these children into the world and it is unconscionable that he refuses to support them, all because his wife was awarded spousal support. His decision to leave Canada permanently is his choice, but his failure to send funds to support his children is legally and morally wrong.

      The notion that we as taxpayers should fulfill his financial obligations is unseemly. Since Mr. Mills no longer pays tax in Canada, he is contributing nothing.

      This article written almost 2 years ago continues to bring out strong emotions and everyone is entitled to their opinion, as am I. Thank you for adding your opinion to this dialogue.

      • Well, did he have a choice? Was it optional for him just to pay for child support and not the spousal support? Court orders were called to squeeze his life to the extreme limit. He would most probably face jail time even if he committed to pay for his kids. There wasn’t any option for him but just to leave, and hope to reconcile with the children overseas.

        That’s what I exactly did in my divorce as I mentioned earlier, and I will never pay a single penny till I make sure it goes directly to my child.

      • @Georgialee Lang. Seriously? You think, after his wife practically forced him out of the country, half way around the world, where he cannot see his kids on a regular basis, he should STILL pay something? If you are not allowed to BE a dad, you cannot be expected to PAY for it either. I am sure this is a horrible situation for him, but the wife, lawyers and/or courts forced his hand. It is incredible that you can support a verdict that is clearly completely unfair.

      • I sympathise with him but I agree with you that he should pay the child maintenance. As I see it the whole process is about the money, the children have been forgotten. If the kids were really being considered then the first order of business would be to ensure equal custody with each parent having some basic rights to a home for the kids. But I don’t see that, what I see is a system where one parent uses the kids as a means of extorting money from the other. What’s wrong with everybody when they think this is the best way to benifit the kids. Kids don’t give a dam about money, adults do. The woman who needs a huge house and car and spending money is not thinking about the kids, she is thinking about herself. It is a given that the kids come first but when did they become a comodity to be used to secure personal gain from. I miss my kids every single day but I still pay for the things they need but while I am prevented from having them on equal terms to my ex she is getting nothing from me. She took too much when she took my kids. I’m going to take her to court to settle things and I may be faced with the same choices he was but I have spoken to my heavely pregnant wife and she agrees that I have to stand up and say NO even if it means gaol time. Like him I am not going to spend the rest of my life supporting someone that views me as their personal ATM. So how many years will I get do you think?

      • If you want him to take care of his children – give them to him. Do NOT claim moral superiority when you have the state stick a gun in his face and demand money which you spend. There is no way this is moral I don’t care how you name it. Caring for a child isn’t writing a check its making a bed, helping with the homework, getting them clothes, feeding them, housing them. You and women like you simply want a free ride an excuse to steal from someone and stick a gun in someones face to feather your own nest.

      • Care to tell us what rock you’re able to squeeze blood from?

        The guy has been squeezed dry yet you keep going on about child support…smh.

  22. @Georgialee Lang, and you’re 100% positive the he never tried that already (sending money for the child support only)? Moreover, do you think the system would take into consideration the change of his income amount, and thus adjust the assigned child support?

    Either way, the story cannot get really exciting if you mentioned that, right? Someone has to be pure evil and it is Mr. Hans in your case.

    The reason i’m feeling this guy is simply because his story is my exactly my case WORD to WORD, but with one small difference. That I filed for divorce because I found ex cheating on me for years.

    The biggest crime I’ve ever committed and greatest guilt; that I proudly carry, is choosing to live with some dignity than living with a CHEATING betraying greedy lazy wife planning on stealing all of my money (all was documented) since day one. I filed to court all evidence, proves and documents you can think of, but who cares about us or our feelings, we’re living in a modern society, correct? where everything has be split regardless of who’s fault the divorce is.

    I was raised & taught on the principle that cheaters and betrayals can never get awarded. I was pushed to leave the country as I was not able to live on the streets just to award her for cheating on me.

    Probably what I’m saying does not make any sense in the law eyes, but I was, have been & still shouting for humanity justice.

    After I left the country, I tried every possible way to communicate with my child, I sincerely offered sending money to my ex bank account (for child support only) in exchange to be able only to communicate with my kid. Yet, she refused any way of communications. She refused even letting me see a single picture of him.
    “All the money or you’ll never see your kid, not even a single photo of him ever again”, last message I got when we communicated after my leave.

    I do miss my kid big time, pray everyday that i could reconcile with him, and can do nothing else now but to wait for him to get old enough, and keep searching the social media on his name hoping he could create a profile one day.

    • Same Boat here…But the Free Ride is now over. I am no longer negotiating anything…until all of my Conditions are met! I dont even care if they Kill Me. Thank God MGTOW is increasing at a rapid rate in Canada. Watch the countries Birthrate decline, and watch the Professional Single Mommy Agenda go right through the Floor Boards! The ultimate end to Emotional, Physical and Financial Extortion by this Man Hating System! In 10 Years…Collapse! Quick Ladies, invest in your Box of Kittens now…you will need them!!!

  23. The author woman who wrote this article is “morally bankrupt”! Hand Mills, you are 100% right, and you are a victim.. you did *precisely* the right thing by leaving.. The best possible thing, when your next best option is suicide because this woman and a corrupt court decided your life meant nothing at all, and that your children didn’t need a father. Women just want to take, take, take, without limits nor shame. When the court allows that, the court is committing grand theft — a felony. Call it whatever else you want to call it and it is still a crime, and people think it is somehow okay only because a judge is committing the crime along with the woman in the divorce case?? COME ON! They are common criminals, and should be tried in a criminal court, and because they are criminals the children should be taken away from their mother. But of course that won’t happen because the court is corrupt, unaccountable to the People, and discriminates against men. Oh, and I’d be surprised if you allow my comment to be posted and stay posted.. why? Because you’re another woman, and you don’t want the truth to be printed!

  24. m1 you are my hero, even though I am married I know some friends who were nearly homeless because of unfavorable settlements as a result of a one-sided ruling from their judges due to their cheating exes. They had to live with their parents for at least a decade AND not see their children because of the corrupt court laws in North America. Some of those kids later rebelled and cut all ties with their biological mother, but a few were not so fortunate. And no, I am not blaming all women, rather I am blaming the cheating ones who just HAD to kindly put it: maximize their reproductive success by cheating and/or treating everyone they bunk with as an ATM machine while neglecting their own children unless they become a success story.Of course, family law is inexact science, but when you hear stories of a boy who was raped under 15 and paying child support in North America, you know society has become hijacked by feminazis their fascist lawyer buddies,judges and other power abusers(the real criminals). I bet our government spent more money in the last few decades chasing deadbeat dads(domestic and foreign), than stopping pedophiles and murderers( 21 years and he’s out and re-offending again, sound familiar?). Anyways, I’ve recently told one of my friends who had a bitter divorce to be ready to cash out everything and maybe even burn his citizenship once he gets his new one in another country (unless the court changes their mind,which I highly doubt). Even now, that friend’s son is starting to realize what a horrible mother he has and has even went as far to ask to be taken in by one of his school teachers(after school) since his mom’s new boyfriend beats him everyday after school because he hates the fact he is a musician(he plays in the school and cadet band), gets good grades in his other courses(except P.E) and isn’t a star athlete that he wants him to be. I hope one day the idiot judge who let that dog abuse her own child she loses custody and someone who will actually appreciate his talents and effort takes him in soon as their child.

    • Anyways, enough bad news and badmouthing. I just learned today that my friend’s child is no longer in his mother’s custody anymore. The music teacher at the school took it upon himself to take the child into his own custody since the child’s own father is on long term disability(from an injury at work, he’s in a wheelchair and requires assistance). The judge initially sided with the mother and her crooked team of lawyers(paid for by the boyfriend), but after hearing testimonials from the staff at the school, classmates and the especially the teacher himself, the judge quickly relented and rewarded custody to the music teacher. Now the child will no longer have to worry about being beaten up after school anymore and can even act as a mentor for the teacher’s young kids after school. I later learned that this same biased judge who rewarded the mother custody in the first place has a nephew who once hired this teacher for private music lessons and one day he told his uncle how much he loved everything he learned from this man, and even highly recommended him to his cousins and friends. I guess the judge knew how much it would upset his nephew and children if they were to find out that he made a one sided ruling against one of their favorite role models. The dad will continue paying child support, but now with more reasonable terms(he has a great relationship with the teacher and family), and can now rest easy now knowing it won’t be spent on superficial luxuries or things that aren’t needed(the mom’s current boyfriend once bought a punching bag and boxing gloves for her son as an “apology” to the child after beating him the night before,to make himself look like he cared). The son is now in the process of filing a restraining order against his mom and current boyfriend plus any subsequent boyfriends/husbands, and will remain in effect until he reaches age 19(unless he says otherwise). I’m glad there’s happy ending to this child custody battle story. But not all child custody battles end like this. Bless the teacher and the rest of his family for doing something like this and giving the dad another reason to stay within the country and reconnect with his son again. Now I’m off to deal with another friend’s dad who seems to have an axe to grind with his son since the day he was born, while his mother is the one that actually cares.

      • Very glad for your friend and his son. Not matter what, in one way or another, and sooner or later, Justice has to prevail.

  25. What is best country in the world to move avoiding child support in the US? It seems they have ties everywhere and the places they don’t aren’t places id want to live.

  26. I guess I recently joined the ranks of the dead beat dads ,I have been paying for my three kids as I should since their mother posted her private parts on line during internet affairs.We properly divorced and she took everything but the light bulbs (let’s be accurate I had a cup a knife a fork and a bent spoon I got the house with no equity and fridge plus stove )Not a curtain or blanket or toilet paper remained. I made extra payments so she wouldn’t loose her vehicle ,I had to take her to mediation to get her to do braces on our middle child .As he had a clef pallet and wasn’t speaking well because of his teeth.I remarried to a wonderful gal and we continue to pay support ,my wife lost her mom and dad a few years ago ,and I lost my mom last year right after mom passed my job was cut as a cut back ,I’m 47 been working oil patch since 18 numerous injuries including a fractured neck and 3 damaged discs in my back .since my Mom passed and the job stress (including being a foreman fielding calls during my Moms funeral service )I asked for temp decrease in hi stress decision making (that got me laid off) the stress seams to amplify the arthritis pain and fatigue plus insomnia .My doctor has been great helping me getting on a sleep apnea machine and dealing with fatigue while I’m on ui still looking for work .I keep getting told I’m over qualified plus getting up there in years for oil field work .so we recently filed an ISO form to reduce my payments ,DO NOT EVER! Use this system .The judge treated the case like I didn’t bother to show up the x had a lawyer she works for show up and now I have more to pay plus all the education and child support for our son who has been out of school for a year ,the judge said well he intentionally lowered his income but this will fix that .So now I get the package in mail saying I have to comply as of October 1 we received it Nov 20 ? I’m already defaulted not like I have the extra money anyhow,so now I still pay but am looking at jail time ,or ……. As I can’t pay there is no more money all rsps gone One toy left to sell …..I HAVE ALWAYS TRiED TO BE AN EXAMPLE OF WORK HARD DONT GIVE UP for my kids even though I haven’t seen or spoken to them since 2011when they were last here to visit and were disgusted to learn we had not been able to get permanent power to our house from the last time our support payments were raised
    As we couldn’t afford the expense .So now I still pay but not enough to clear my name and will have to live with a criminal record no license and does anyone know if they serve macncheese in jail as the last 4 years I have become rather used to it .

    • James Let me tell you what I see all the time:

      1. Good father who has always paid support becomes unemployed;
      2. Judge automatically believes the lack of employment is a strategy to stop paying support;
      3. Father is ill and cannot work or can only work a limited amount, but judge believes father is a malingerer.
      4. The only way a father can prove to a judge that his lack of employment or illness is legitimate is to have an affidavit from your employer explaining why father no longer has a job. If illness is the cause, you must have an affidavit from your doctor(s) setting out the diagnosis treatment plan, expected recovery date. Anything less will not be enough;
      5. Simply swearing under oath the reasons for unemployment or illness will not suffice. Judge will not believe you.
      6. Fathers who have sufficient funds to hire a lawyer (count on about $10,000 or more) will usually get some relief, but not always.
      7. ISO is a lost cause for fathers in your situation.
      8. You have my utmost sympathy. Our system sucks!

      • I don’t feel there is any support for dads in this system ,I can easily get doctors note but the judge and lawyer already have me in a situation of arrears ,and set it up to get financially more difficult in Jan I sold my motorcycle that used to be my de stress for half what it was worth back when we were still paying required amount.the money’s gone .she wins I have nothing and can’t have anything if I could run I would but I have no were to go ,my daughter was telling my whole family and neighbours about how her mom buys her pot so it’s not laced ,I looked into what I could do was told nothing would come of it but I could proceed if I felt compelled .My x gas been a receptionist or legal secretary for every firm in my home town in BC and now has backing (that’s constantly rubbed in my face)I’m Edmonton .

      • @Georgialee Lang what are the chances ill be told to pay alimony ?: married for 3 years with a son of 3 yrs old, wife (31 yrs old) stayed home for a year and there after we did all to help her career while I took care of my son most of the time (take him to and from daycare, stayed with him while she is away etc) while she works (but never declared it in tax, she says she is unemployed, though I have copies of her paychecks and proofs that we have been working on her career ). in the first 2 years pay difference was on our taxes was $50,000, in the last year the difference became 90,000 (based on that she still declares she is unemployed). no properties involved. during the 3rd year I gave her in full about $20,000 to do her business before the marriage came to end. what are the chances ill be told to pay alimony considering this our judicial system ? Thanks

      • Thanks Georgialee Lang. I like your reasonable approach. I’m a man and became separated end of 2006 when my wife left after I tried to take her to hospital for examination (suspicion of psychosis) as advised by my doctor. After she left home, the court ordered joint custody and child support (money from me for 3 kids) during 2008 which I started paying even before the order. Although my ex. asked for divorce, she was not accepting to sign the divorce documents. I was working but could not afford paying the expensive lawyer fees after the deduction of child support. I was not sure what to do. I was also suffering from depression but became worse and I was hospitalized and treated with electric shocks. After spending almost one year trying to reconcile with her for the kids sake, I met someone. However, since the divorce was not complete, I could not get married again in Canada. Therefore, I left Canada and now living abroad. I am still sending child support to her’s or the kids’ bank accounts but she is not acknowledging receipt of all payments. I am now fifty years old. I am married and have a 4 years old child. I pay for an expensive airfare and endure a long and tiring trip to visit my kids in Canada on annual basis. I am not sure what options I have. I hope I can go back to Canada to be near my kids and to introduce them to their sister.

  27. Instead of everyone complaining, I’d like to hear success stories, what countries are possible escape countries to get ourselves out of this mess? What is the process, I believe you need a VISA? and I don’t want to goto a country that does participate with the Americans and not be a 100 % are we referring to the reciprocating list??

  28. I have been shaken up by the ordeal of the relationship I have gone through. We met via a matrimonial site. She was divorced earlier and this was my first marriage. Initially I was reluctant but soon I was attracted to her and we got to know each other. Parents talked. I was living outside US and was decently employed. She visited my country and I went and saw her at her parents house. Her father was an ex diplomat of my country and I was surprised when he booked a room for the both of us to spend time.

    Soon we got married. My father gave us jewellery worth more than $ 50,000. I learnt just before marriage that she was fired from her job because she left to get married and did not have enough days for leaves. Initially things were good. I took her to Seychelles, Italy, Switzerland, France and many other places. She was to come back to US after a family function at my side. After few months she came back and we stayed together for few months before my immigration to US got finalized and we came here. Immediately after coming here I got a job. She started a joint account depositing $ 25 and then all my salary would come in the joint account which she would use to shop and my salary will pay all household bills and often her expensive shopping via her credit card. She was a little crazy, for simple small things she used to get upset and would not talk for days. After coming to US she started behaving more strangely. She would drive to a far off mall and would leave me there and drive back and leave me shivering in the cold. She would abuse me financially and emotionally. I would be the one to clean all utensils and do all household chores while she would not even do simple things when I would ask her. Often she would demand lot of money from me telling me that she has done my immigration so I should pay her money. The jewellery that we gave her she kept in her mother’s locker and whatever gifts we had from the marriage she transported those to her parents place. She also took away some jewellery that her parents had given me.

    She became pregnant and wanted to go back to her parents place to bear the baby so I made all arrangements to drop her to my country where her parents lived. I came back to US alone because I was still working and was paying the rent for her apartment and all household bills etc. She would call me in the middle of the night and abuse me for slightest of things and would keep a check on me for smallest of expenses. For example buying a sweater.

    In Jan this year our daughter was born and I went back to my country along with 2 bags full of gifts to see the mother and the child. I also gave her more than $ 5000. I was thrashed at her parents house. She told me that I should just leave. Her father told me that I have seen his good face and now he will show me his bad face. I was surprised and confused. Her father apparently had some business loss and was demanding money from me all this while. I asked my father to transfer more than $ 7000 to her mother’s account. I was there for a month and then came back saddened. She had purposefully booked my return ticket on my birthday and when I landed I saw that she had withdrawn $ 7000 from our joint account and transferred the money to her account.

    I was depressed by the way this family had treated me and still tried my best to work things. I would call her and tell her to come back. I had married her for a life time but from their side it was all about money and extortion. Her father had behaved like her pimp.

    In July, I had a near fatal car accident and I was in the hospital for five days. After this I begged her to come back and help me but instead she demanded me that I should pay her $ 10,000 for the car damages. I had lost my job because I could not go to work for few days. I told her I cannot give her now and that she should give me some time for which she abused me and told me that my mother passed away ten years ago because God had punished me and that God is punishing me now too. I was so heart broken. My father came to help me after this accident. Some months passed and I found another job. In September, without my knowledge she came with her parents and stayed somewhere else and in October she did the most vindictive thing possible. We were given orders of protection and I was to vacate the apartment in 10 minutes. I was left homeless and my old father who came to help me was insulted. I went to a motel and in the next court date we were handed over child custody and child support papers.

    This woman and her family are extorting money from me in the name of child support now. I was still recovering after the shock of that accident and now I am going through so many court cases. She has abused the law that favors women to her advantage in multiple ways. Her parents are well to do and they are supporting her in all her misdeeds to extort money from me. In her previous divorce also, I got to know that she made lot of money via alimony and property settlement.

    Now she will misuse the child support money against me further and I would not be able to bear this situation. Already I am suffering from the multiple atrocities done by her pimp father on me. I might have to go back to my country because I cannot bear this situation. But in this process I will loose my daughter. She has already stolen her childhood from me. The biggest problem is they have employed tactics to extort money from me and are misusing law to cheat an honest and innocent man.

    • A survey is underway on 2015 Gender-Bias Survey of the Family Court Decisions in the Province of British Columbia, Canada Is Gender Bias Real? – will show numbers and charts, comparing three court levels.

      The Equal Parenting group’s website has numerous stories, articles, and links about gender bias, and even allegations that women can “lie to the court with impunity”:

      FatherMagazine (.com) alleges that the “pendelum has swung the other way”, and the gender bias now heavily discriminates against men.

  29. A couple of things that various commentors have posted, but are still very relevant points:

    The average house price in 2014 in Ontario is under $400k, back in 2008 she lived in a house worth $1.2 million, with equity worth $600k and you’re choosing to focus on the mortgage aspect? This woman could sell the $1.2 million, move into a house worth more than the average mortgage free and a big chunk of her expenses disappear.

    They had a previous arrangement in place that she chose to re neg on , yet the biased court didn’t re-balance the original settlement and then back-charge alimony, only back-charge the alimony.

    The guy was earning $100k a year which, is only $73,560 after tax. The judge ordered him to pay his ex-wife $45,264 per year leaving him just $2,358 per month on which to live for himself, including rent/mortgage, food, electricity, etc. It sounds like a lot, but not for a guy who’ll most likely only be able to afford a 1-bedroom apartment whilst he’s still effectively paying for his ex-wife to live it up in a $1.2 million house. The intent behind alimony was to ensure divorced women were not out on the street, but to suggest the man be required to keep his ex-wife in far more comfort than the man himself could afford is ridiculous.

    We don’t have alimony where I’m from (Australia), but our courts are just as heavily slanted against men and I’ve got three stories to relate:

    1. A ‘fair’ divorce?

    A guy worked hard from the day he left school at 16, saved up every penny and purchased his first house outright at 24 years old. He got married at 28 and had a couple of children. About 25 years later, he and his wife divorced after their adult children had moved out and he had to take out a $200k loan against the house he’d originally purchased in order to hang onto it. So far, no objections as the length of time they’d both lived in the house. He worked really hard to pay that mortgage off quickly and settled back into a normal life by himself in his own house.
    Here’s where it gets interesting: a few years later he meets a woman, they date for a while before she moves in with him. She lives with him for about 2 years before packing up and leaving one day. The next contact he had from her was from her lawyer who was proceed with ‘divorce’ proceedings (they were never married) and she SUCCESSFULLY was awarded half of his house, requiring him to take out a $400k mortgage to ‘pay her out her share’ for a house he’d lived in for over 30 years and she 2 years.
    Just imagine being a 56 years old man, thinking you’re all set for retirement with your house all paid off and a woman can literally change all of that so easily. He can now never retire if he chooses to stay in the house he’s live in most of his life.

    2. Child support / randsom

    Another guy I know found himself paying child support for his daughter and the interesting thing was that it was never enough. The mother kept applying to the courts for more money, but she’s already been allocated the maximum from what this guy earned. The guy was a salary worker with no possible prospect of cash-in-hand jobs or extra money from overtime, so every year like clockwork he’d get his child support payments challenged and increased when his annual pay rise came around.
    The mother took a different approach to getting extra money: extortion. She’d ask for a few hundred dollars more on the side, he’d refuse because she’d just spend it on shoes, cigarettes or clothes, so she’d ‘forget’ that it was his weekend for visitation. He’d put up with that same treatment for a few times before taking her to court, the judge would tell the mother off, but nothing would ever happen.
    He worked out that, given he wasn’t eligible for legal aid, it would cost him about $500 every time he wanted to bring her before the court, so it became easier for him to just give her any amount less than that just to see his child. This money was ON TOP of the court ordered maximum payment he was ordered to pay.

    3. I caught up with some distant relatives and noted that one whole arm of one part of my family had no children running around. None. I asked if they’d just been left at home for the day. They hadn’t. After a little questioning I worked a few things out. The mother (matriarch) of that family had divorced the father of her three sons, taken him for all he was worth before marrying a new guy. This new guy, who received no respect from any of the three boys, received even less respect from the woman herself! She still, to this day, berates and belittles him in social settings.
    When asked if she has any grandchildren she coldly replied “I don’t think any of my sons are considering doing that ever”.
    What I came to realise is that all three of these boys had seen their biological father torn down and taken financially for everything he was worth, had seen their substitute father berated and belittled constantly and each had independently decided that they didn’t want to follow in the footsteps of either life example.
    In the case of the couple of your original post, how many of the older children’s problems are related to the way the mother treated their father?

    Some of the comments make note of how courts can view sudden unemployment as a ploy to avoid paying alimony, but are you aware of the double standard? If there aren’t any jobs going locally for certain profession, then a man in that situation would have to relocate in order to continue to make payments. So, in your eyes it’s a man’s duty to do whatever it takes to provide for his family and see them fed, including moving across the country, yet this woman is ok to just sit in a house with more than enough equity in it to buy a median house outright in the same state with cash left over rather than sell it, clear the mortgage and, with it, reduce her expenses that appear to be the underlying issue.
    Had that man stuck around, then by the time he could ‘retire’ he’d effectively have paid off his ex-wife’s house as well as his own and she’d be living in a multi-million dollar house paid for by her ex-husband. Again, this comes back to the whole “manner to which they’d become accustomed” since the man was highly unlikely to be able to afford to buy his own $1.2 million house, so the rest of his working life would be spent propping up another individual to live in a nicer, more expensive house than he himself could afford. Some would call that slavery.

    It’s cases like the one you’ve written about that see more and more people saying “hey, I think I’d do the same if I were in that situation”.

    The man is doing a variation of the term “going Galt”. He’s depriving the system of his earnings and letting it starve. Don’t think this is an isolated incident and definitely don’t think that shaming men will prevent them from doing this as each and every one of them knows they’ll be labelled as deadbeats. It takes a whole lot of guts to just pack up and leave your life and start over. About the only thing that will slow the rising tide of this will be for the divorce courts to be fairer to men. The ex-wife in this case clearly knew she was putting a ridiculous amount of pressure on the man as she had even gone to ask the government to prevent him leaving the country! The man obviously did his sums and worked out he would no longer be his own man, but rather a wallet to a woman who was still living in their family home and that he’d be better off leaving.

    Everyone has their breaking point, and this woman just applied the straw that broke the camel’s back.

  30. I can only agree with all the posts. I am going through an ugly divorce as well. My wife will most likely try to extort legal custody or even visitation against the right amount of money (alimony/child support). I love our children very much but since my job does not allow me to work in close proximity to our home anyway, I will face some hard decisions. I recommend everybody in this situation to work on a second citizenship …
    Also the book from Stephen Baskerville “Taken into Custody”. Very good!

    Stay strong!

    • Imo, you don’t have to escape to the Philippines. Check this, but I don’t think Quebec has a reciprocal enforcements of judgments agreement with BC. (Imo, not a legal opinion, maybe its just as good as the Russia, etc.)

  31. I’m so thoroughly happy for this guy who fled Canada and escaped to the Philippines! It’s not very often the good guy wins. It’s th system and his x wife who is morally bankrupt. Poor man, he made a binding divorce agreement and she wants to renig and steal more of his livelihood ? What did she do with the $600k equity she recieved from the house? He only got $175k, she came out way ahead if you ask me.

    Men are sick and tired of getting raped in feminists leaning divorce courts. Ladies, I realize not all of you are trying to rape your x”s or financially ruin them like this lady was attemptimg to do, but for thee rest who are, you reap what you sow . Men are tired of feminism and the bias that exists in the legal system against men. Thank goodness there are countries who will not bend to feministic laws and where the US legal system has no reach! This story was an inspiring read in that for once, one of the good guys won! The system is really screwed up. I hope more men wake up and do the same.

    • What you’re alleging is endemic, wide-scale bias, against men. What we have in the nearly 90 comments here are “anecdotes” i.e. anecdotal evidence of discrimination, capital D, Discrimination, or even louder DISCRIMINATION.

      This country is not supposed to have DISCRIMINATION against any group.

      How is DISCRIMINATION proven in a court of law, or at least in the public opinion? Let’s look at the United States, which has an headstart on Canada, insofar as ANTI-DISCRIMINATION class actions. Proof is done by population distribution — if the bell curve of the suspected discriminated group doesn’t match the background population, that is enough proof to establish a class action (called “class proceedings” in Canadian courts).

      Here’s what has to be done, in order to stop DISCRIMINATION against men:

      1) Gather statistics of relevant BC cases
      2) Overlap the bell curves
      3) Put the chart on the ‘net
      4) See if some man, a victim of DISCRIMINATION will start a class action

      There are also other ways perhaps to litigate, see the novel case that won finally in the Supreme Court of Canada, the famous “Jane Doe” case, which gave Canadians ‘civil rights’. (This is the negligence case, in the serial rapist case, in Toronto.)


    • http://www.canlii.org/en/bc/bcca/doc/2010/2010bcca226/2010bcca226.html?searchUrlHash=AAAAAQALRGFsZSBGb3RzY2gAAAAAAQ&resultIndex=3

      That’s the BC Court of Appeal judgment on the Permberton woman who spent $180K on her case, and her lawyer is foreclosing on her because she can’t pay her lawyer.

      The guy also had to pay a lawyer, unless it was on contingency.

      The BC Court of Appeal reduced his “win” to 1/10 of the original judgment.

      The man worked for years for her, to upgrade her property and build her a house. (The lower court said the worksmanship wasn’t adequate, but imo these court judgments are merely “alibi” to screw men in the court proceedings, so I do not believe that the man’s works was really substandard.)

      What’s the outcome, for the man and the woman? Bad, very bad. Disaster. The winner is the lawyer(s).

      Moral of the story? Greedy women can lose. It’s as old as Aesop’s parables. She should have merely given the man the $100K, and he would probably walked away happy.

      Insofar as this man needing to declare bankrupcy from the court costs, imo, that is unnecessary. The baiiffs will not waste their time, and she probably doesn’t have money left to pursue execution.

      • To clarify, “execution” is how “collection” is defined in the courts. It can include a Writ of Seizure and Sale. If you use Canlii.org, you’ll see a few examples, by searching for BAILIFF and WRIT OF SEIZURE. The bailiff cannot enter a home if it is locked and the debtor doesn’t invite the bailiff. Clothing, personal effects, cars, tools can only be seized IF they are above a certain level which is defined by law in BC. In practical terms, from the bailiff sites in BC, you can see that vehicles and equipment are the items usually seized, in divorce matters. If you add the word POUNDAGE in the search, you can see that IF a vehicle is leased, or co-owned, the bailiff can’t seize it legally, either. So, in the Pemberton woman’s story, the man didn’t have to worry about a bailiff coming after him, as it appears he doesn’t have any assets that can be seized. Poetic justice??

  32. Quiz: How well we know our feminist dictatorship?
    Q: We know all judges are against splitting siblings. Can you describe a scenario when all judges are for splitting siblings?
    A: When one already lives with the father.

  33. I am a 44 year old single male living in Canada. The last few years I have had this overwhelming feeling that I want a child. This feeling that I have missed out on life by not getting married and having a child.

    After researching peoples view points on marriage and divorce I have completely changed my mind. I think I will never get married, and even though I am alone I am beginning to think that I have made the right choice to stay a bachelor.

    I feel sorry for all you men who have commented on your horrific experiences and I wish you the best.

    • Here’s some useful information for males, should you be thinking about a “mate”:

      You must find:
      – Someone who had a happy, trauma-free childhood (women will mostly lie about this, too)
      – Someone who has never taken a single psychiatric drug, or has been in psychological therapy
      – Someone who never had cats (Google: Cat Scratch Disease)
      – Had parents and grand parents who didn’t have mental disorders (psychosis can cross generations)

      If you are living with a female, be cautious, and read “The Predatory Female”, and see if any of the symptoms are present.

      To men in general, please read the book written by a woman, “The Manipulated Man”, who exposes how women allegedly think.

      • Agreed. Also search Scot Young from the UK and his 7 year divorce proceeding which led to his suicide in Dec. 2014.

        Read the Manipulated Man written by a woman with a PHD.

        Read Alec Baldwin’s “a promise to ourselves” and know parental alienation is real despite him spending $1 million on lawyers and still lost.

        Do a Canlii search on McCain’s divorce (the french fry company) and know that a postnup will not stand a chance in court based on duress (even though she had a lawyer review it).

    • Thank you…Glad you saw the light before it was too late. Don’t worry about dying alone…most people die alone! Marriage is nothing more than a Fraud Contract…and there is virtually nothing in it for a Man. Marriage has no more value than Common Law and Same Sex Marriage! The average Divorce is now dropping down to 4 Years. It’s a Rigged Poker Game with High Stakes and Low Yield. Single Men are far happier than Married Men. Married Men often loath their situation, but they are reluctant to admit it.

    • Thank you Chris. The Danger is REAL. It is not the Cut and Dry, Fifty-Fifty or Fair is Square that you have been taught to believe all along…since Day One! You have a chance to enjoy real freedom, and do the things you really want to do! Look Seriously into MGTOW Activism. Improve youself, make Money, Travel the World and do what you want…when you want!!!

  34. Chris…….You are reading stories of people whose marriages did not work out, and who got severely financial damaged from that. Yes, these stories will turn you into a “never want to marry” type. But,…..I am sure you have friends that enjoy their marriages. And,…..there are things you can do to safe guard your financial future and your partner’s financial future should the marriage not work out. But, you have to put these things in place BEFORE you marry. Or, you could choose not to marry…..but, have a lifetime partner and a child.

    You and your partner, whether married or not, if you live together should NOT co-mingle anything you come into the relationship with. If you own a home, or have a savings account, stocks, etc……do NOT put your partner’s name on any of these. And she should NOT put your name on anything she already owns. Set up retirement accounts for each of you in your own names that can grow equally, and each of you can leave with should you part. Find a partner that can pull her own weight financially and has a career she wants to continue. See a lawyer that deals in marital law and write a pre-nup or pre-partnership nup you both are happy with. Address the issues of alimony and child support in this contract. See a lawyer and talk about these issues with your partner to make sure you are both on the same page. The idea is that neither of you get hurt financially, should the partnership not work out. And, like Davy Crockett said,”Be sure you’re right, then go ahead.”

    • Nim – I can see what you’re trying to do, but unfortunately too many people know people who’ve been burnt in spite of having prenuptial agreements in place and have even seen men burnt for even just living together.
      The biggest problem with what you’ve written is that the pre-nup can (and frequently) be thrown out of court, especially in cases where the situation doesn’t perfectly match the outline of the pre-nup. Having children is the biggest argument for the exclusion of the pre-nup in divorce proceedings and, even if it is upheld, usually the amount of child support payments is increased to make up the difference. Let’s face it, any man who argues that his child support payments are too much is met with “what, you don’t want to support your own children?!?”
      I know of a guy who lost half of his $800k house because he let his girlfriend move in and she walked after only 18 months. In order to be able to stay there he had to ‘buy her out’ by taking out a $400k mortgage. Kind of put his retirement plans on hold since he was 60 at the time!
      Of course you’ll respond with “but he didn’t have a pre-nup” and you’re right, but we are fast approaching a culture where men over 45 will not want to live with women out of fear of losing things they’ve spend a lifetime building up over a relationship that lasts less time than a car loan.

      Georgialee Lang – apply for adoption as a single man? What, because single men aren’t already scrutinized enough without doing things that would put the spotlight on them?!?

      • Nim and Andy: Beware of women who drink “sugar free” pop, or consume artificial sweeteners. Such women (and men) have imo destroyed their marriages. I’ve seen this from people I know. When one such woman took a holiday where there was no sugar-free drinks, she came back to Canada as a very nice woman, who promised to never touch the artificially-sweetnened pop, ever again. She kept her promise for a month. A few months later, she was separated.

        Look it up, some percentage of people become antisocial from artificial sweetners. On top of that, many big corporations lie about the stuff in their food and drinks. There have been class actions over this.

    • I also agree and appreciate this blog because it is constantly being updated by users that make valid points and by GeorgiaLee Lang for responding.

  35. It’s Feb 2015. Anyone know the final fate of Donna Mills? Would imagine the house has long since been foreclosed and probably living with relatives. Wonder if she ever got a job or is living off Canadian gov’t assistance? Doubtless she got verbally blasted by others for being so greedy with the Nazi courts backing her.

    Wonder how he likes getting and having to work? hehe

    Mr Hans Mills. You are a hero in my book

    What options did he have in this crooked Nazi court system?

    1) Be an ATM til he or ex-wife dies
    2) Suicide or jail time til he eventually cant make the exorbitant payments
    3) Pay a hit man to off her (Morally I could never do this)
    4) Leave the country and be free from Canadian Nazis

    No reasonable options at all. Being an ATM slave isnt resaonable

    If anyone has updates on anyone in this case. Please post

  36. Pingback: BC Courts Allegedly Discriminate Against Men in Family Court Proceedings | bcdivorcecourtdiscriminationagainstmen

  37. The old Axiom that says that the best realtor is not necessarily the one with the most listings, but the one with the most sales, is true.

    Government data shows that in 2010 uncollected child support in the US is in the billions. Is it possible that it was already awarded too high, but the incentive was the court was granted money for their budget based on how much child support was awarded, not collected?

    Watch “divorce corp” and find out the devastation on children.

    I hope Canada does not have the same system that encourages unsustainable support awards that benefits the courts and not the children that need it the most.

    • AAA. Unfortunately it does. Virtually all of Canadas Divorce and Family Laws mirror US Laws. Maybe only a Cosmetic Difference in the Wording…but that is all.

  38. Wow, to even suggest that the guy here was in the wrong is laughable. The system left him no choice but to leave. No one can afford to pay $4000 a month to someone, especially when they’ve already given them the house! Insane! Me, and every other sane man (or woman) would leave for the Philippines too! What a joke of an article! What silly spin on it by the author. LOL

  39. After taxes he would have to live on $900 a month or $5.62 an hour which is $5 below minimum wage. Absolutely ridiculous. He made the right decision. This is a perfect example of how our feminist-run family court system brutalizes men which drives many to suicide. Of course the divorce lawyers are in on it too. There’s gold in them there wallets.

    • Further to Adm’s opinion: about our feminist-run family court system which brutalizes men to suicide or worse.

      Is Gender Bias Real? – See The Numbers

      2015 Gender Bias Study of the Family Court Decisions
      in the Province of British Columbia, Canada


      The ANSWER is there — see the LawDiva’s post on arbitration.

      The problem is getting husbands and wives, who may or may not be informed, or may be just crazy, into the arbitration or mediation table.

      More on “craziness”: There is the little known (very little known) permanent brain damage from butane gas (yup, from the cigarette lighter) inhalation.

      A FRIEND’S FAMILY MEMBERS RECENTLY DID SOMETHING TOTALLY OUT OF CHARACTER, AFTER THEY IMMEDIATELY ATE SUGAR MELTED BY A LIGHTER. UNBURNT BUTANE WAS INGESTED. BUTANE POISONING, APPARENTLY CAUSES PERMANENT BRAIN DAMAGE. ALSO EXPLAINS WHY ONE WOMAN BECAME ANTIPATHETIC TO HER SPOUSE, AFTER SECRETLY SMOKING AGAIN. The unburnt butane, from cigarette lighters, butane poisoning, explains the mental problems and intermittent irrationality of many smokers, including twitching and depression. Have seen this before, but didn’t see the cause and effect, until now. Some lighters also contain inks and other chemicals. So, smokers, don’t inhale, when lighting up.

      Do a Google search for: Butane – New Experience – Inhalants are dangerous. Do not use this chemical.

  40. I am currently going thru divorce proceedings in New Brunswick. I’m told that alimony (no child support) will be based on the average of my last 3 year income tax (gross amounts). Here’s my problem , I’m an hourly worker and overtime is voluntary. Last year alone I made 135000 gross including military pension. Of that amount about 35000 is from overtime.I’m told I will be paying 2400 to 4400 per month in alimony. If it ends up being the high end I will be forced to work 7 days a week to just barely survive. Bankruptcy will most likely happen especially if overtime is cut (a regular occurrence where I work. Don’t get me wrong, I’ve been married 34 years and want what’s fair. I’m more than willing to give her half my military pension and half my base pay, but to include the overtime and force me to work 7 days a week when she is employable but chooses to look after her terminally ill mother (For the last 7 years) is ludicrous. She has also held several jobs in that time. Also she is in N.B.(& years) and I’m in ON. What am I supposed to do? I have a female lawyer and she says her hands are tied by the system as far as what I’m to pay. Again WHAT AM I SUPPOSED TO DO? I have considered taking a job in another country as a last resort but I love Canada and don’t want to leave. But if all I’m doing is scraping by while she lives in comfort and doesn’t have to work what other choice do I have?

    • You need to fall down and hurt your back. Take some time off work and when you go to court tell them that you can’t possibly make that kind of money again after hurting yourself.

      You should also point out that the only reason you worked so many hours is because your wife wouldn’t work and spent so much time taking care of ill family. That you have been exploited financially by a deadbeat wife and shouldn’t be forced to continue to support someone who has contributed so little.

      Sadly, since your pension is military you can’t leave the country. You are pretty much screwed.

      That said, let your story be the cautionary tale for others. Don’t get married. Ever.

      • Military pensions allow you leave the country but it doesn’t stop the courts from intercepting your pension at the source before it gets deposited to your bank account. My brother left the country for the philippines with his military pension intact. Of course he has no kids or ex wife to support either.

    • You should Skype with me , I am going through this child support bs and now in poverty. almost homeless, very close to it, if your going through divorce as stated and you have kids your in a mess like me, they take more money from me then the court has ordered, hence why I’m broke now.

      • Both our boys are grown up and on their own so there won’t be any child support. Wouldn’t mind chatting with you to share experiences dealing with divorce in N.B. Don’t have Skype but maybe we can work out a way to communicate.

  41. I think it is the author of this article who is morally bankrupt.

    Mr. Mills did take care of his children. He gave a generous settlement to his wife which should have set her up for years. He gave generous child support to take care of his children.

    Is it his fault that his wife refused to work and support herself?
    Is it his fault that his wife continued to live well beyond her means in a million dollar home?

    It is Mrs. Mills who broke the agreement and decided to extort more money from her ex husband. It’s unfortunate the circumstances that Mrs. Mills found herself in. Had she been married it would definitely been her husband’s obligation to support her.

    But Mrs. Mills chose to leave and therefore chose to severe the obligations that Mr. Mills had towards her.

    It is immoral for her to use the courts to exploit her ex-husband. It is immoral for the courts to enslave a man after he had already agreed to pay generously to his ex-wife and children.

    I totally support his choice to leave the country. I think more men should do this.

    • Nothing to add here other than precisely correct. No one should ever be entitled to money for life.
      Marriage must stop being viewed as a contract for life..
      It should really have a 5 yr term that must be legally renewed in order to continue.

  42. Hans Mills is a straight up hero!

    Get used to men not wanting to marry you ladies. You wanted to be “strong and independent” and now you’ve got it. So woman up, go work your 40 – 60 hour work weeks and pay those taxes to support all of the singles moms out there. Enjoy the decline! MGTOW

    • When I got married where was the contract that I signed that stated that if I marry someone who is not my finical equal that I’ll have to pay them to live the life they have become accustomed to . My situation also leaves me in a position of leaving the country my kids are grown , wife has never been laid off in 28 years , full pension in 3 years paying 1400 mnth , makes 3500 mnth ( 50 K ) , I agreed to 50 -50 split of all assets, savings , etc , my salary 170 K , no pension , lawyers are asking for $ 5000 mnth spousal .

      Wife has 250 k from sale of house , 120 k from inheritance and 1400 a month pension, 3500 a month salary , yet I have to pay her $5000 and I make $ 8500 a month leaving me 3500 , so I now make what she makes this cant be real , when I have to get up each day to go to work in order to pay my wife is the day I leave this country !!!

      Scenerio , If I was to lose my job say at 170 k a year and can only find a job at 100 k can I sue for support payments for the company paying me 170 k cause my standard of living has gone down, if not why is a marriage any different ? Both suffer
      Only in Canada Eh

      • I learned the hard way that trying to apply logic, ethics or even common sense to Divorce or Family Law in Canada is a waste of time. The only logic is: If you are a man = you will pay until you die and even beyond that if you have an estate or pension etc.

        The Divorce Industry is just that – an industry – so it is not in the interest of the beneficiaries of said industry (namely Lawyers and the Courts in which they practice) to be remotely fair or equitable as keeping the conflict going and punishing the breadwinners (who still tend to be men) as much as possible serves their commercial interests.

        It’s simply not worth it to get married in the US/Canada and you would be insane to take the risk.

        If you can leave, do so so at at your earliest opportunity – hostility toward men in general in North America is not going to go away anytime soon. More likely it will intensify as the feminazi’s get more influence.

        Don’t contribute to and feed the misandrist beast with you hard-earned money,

      • Here’s a challenge to any men, commenting on LawDiva’s blog, to do something, other than just say, “I give up, the system is tooo bad.” (Sorry, but I stopped attending “men’s support groups” because they didn’t seem to have any courage left in their hearts. All I heard from men was, “it was so unfair to me.” )

        Since there is statistical evidence of anti-male bias in the BC courts, would some real men out there, please take on the admin, or whoever is responsible, for the courts to the BC Human Rights Tribunal? I have seen mostly victories by the filing parties in that forum.

        Check it out, on http://www.canlii.org. Here’s a link:


        Btw, this suggestion is not mine. I heard it, over lunch with guys, from a guy who has two lawyer brothers.

  43. what I have never understood and will never understand is men who leave their first wives with two or three children, to move in with a new girlfriend who has two or three children from other relationships. How does that even make any sense?

    • It’s because they are Prisoner to the Golden Vajayjay Syndrome! They’re stuck in Blue Pill Values, and actually think that they can’t get by without a Woman. So they foolishly repeat the Cycle over and over. Jumped out of one Fry Pan…and went straight back into another!!!

  44. Another thought comes to mind – most people get married and make promises and vows usually in front of witnesses in church or other places of importance whether they believe in God or not. It seems that these vows are words spoken absentmindedly and perhaps insincerely. Although many western countries have very liberal divorce laws, they somewhat take those vows/promises quite seriously when it comes to dividing assets and child support. Would it not be so much cheaper to spend the money on good relationship counseling, for individuals to be less selfish and be faithful and loyal to the vows that are made? The sad thing about running away is one can never runaway from their own conscious. That part of you that must sleep before you do.

    • Olive It doesn’t make any sense to me….what I often tell my clients is that it doesn’t get easier the second time around…marriage is hard work, particularly when you are supporting two families. Thanks for commenting! Georgialee

    • Olive, it doesn’t make “sense”, but their actions are dictated by unhappy childhoods, genetics, and other causes leading to mental disorders. Check out the psych forums — tally the hundreds of posts by partners/spouses of people with disorders, like bipolar and narcissitic or borderline personality disorders. You’ll see that the average relationship is less than 3 years duration. Sadly, the “receiving” partner/spouse will also be damaged and carry “baggage” into the next relationship, resulting in a push-pull, self-fulfilling abandonment, or PTSD thoughts.

  45. court system in canada is disgusting. How can they take so much from that man and he can’t even feed him self. the court rather see him homeless and pay for children but at the end of the day he can’t even afford to eat and put a roof over his head. There are too many vindictive women in the country who feel they can get away with anything. yes we may all need help as some point but when are you also gonna get up and help yourself at the same time. court system sucks in canada but it’s also made easy so that women can work we have programs that are subsidized where your paying next to nothing sometimes $0.00 for daycare every month based on income. Yes her children need a lot care based on their health status but there are programs geared to that, grants that you can get and benefits that you may be approved for i was once on the system and the caseworker told me i can stay home until my child is six. i said no thank you i need help now but this is no long term thing i’m going to school get my education that diploma/degree and make a life for me and my children and did all of that while pregnant with a second one.

    it’s sad and i don’t wrong him for running like really how was he supposed to live.
    oh he could have ate grass to survive, it’s all good!

  46. We should now add after last weeks incident in South Carolina that if you don’t pay child support in the United States you are shot. Walter Scott who had served 5 years in the US coast guard and never had any violent history was killed by a police officer just because he was behind his child support and had therefore a contempt of court order and an arrest warrant against him. Considering that the US is incarcerating more people in the world than any other country (in total and as a percentage), this should not be a surprise to us anymore. Gentlemen, get your second passport going.

    • RE VIOLENCE from the female gender:

      Just see the LawDiva blog, new, on this woman:

      To my mind, it shows that woman can commit crime, but not do time, in Canada.

      Just my opinion: If this woman had been jailed for child abduction, or sent to a psychiatrist, the murders may have been prevented. I say “maybe” because the psychotropic meds actually cause the person taking it to lose their “humanity” and “conscience”.

      Here’s the bigger issue: A male who commits child abduction would have been treated differently. In fact, a husband can get ejected, thrown out of a home, by police, just on any (perhaps mentally-unstable) wife’s “fear”. If not by police, with an ex parte motion by the wife’s lawyer. I know of two real incidents, where this happened. The bigger issue is descrimination, against men, by the “authorities”, who ignore the fact that the women are “behind the domestic violence”, statistically.

      So, as someone in this forum already said: Guys, don’t just take this discrimination, take the “authorities” to the Human Rights Tribunal, and get some justice, even if by a few dollars win.

      Thanks to the LawDiva’s blog for that story on the Mississauga woman.

      I almost forgot: That Mr. Jamali on another LawDiva blog should find out if he can complain about the obvious bias (as the BC Court of Appeal said) from the judge, Groves, in his divorce trial. It was also odd that the BC Court of Appeal didn’t put the name of Judge Groves in the appeal decision for Mr. Jamali, and that the Court of Appeal didn’t speak about giving Mr. Jamali his “costs” in his appeal win, over his former wife.

      • It’s one of the only and worst ‘dirty tricks’ in family law…The Ex-Parte Motion.
        My ex tried this on me, launched it along with an affidavit filled with the most heinious lies and accusations two days after I left overseas for a week. She made claim for exclusive possession, sole custody and a restraining order…
        Fortunately, I thought they might try this and made a point of calling the Clerk’s office daily. When the motion was served upon the court (without respondent) I explained to the court that the whole basis for an emergency motion was moot….as I was out of the country and could not pose any immediate threat.
        The judge was suspicious of the timing (and possibly the wild accusations) and allowed me to respond via un unsworn affidavit.
        I shredded her affidavit with overwhelming evidence that most of it was either outright lies and/or hyperbole and exaggerations. (Gentlemen, audio tape EVERY and ALL interactions with a STBX)
        Her motion was quashed, I was awarded 50/50 custody, 50/50 occupation of the home and a restraining order was ordered upon her.
        So….watch out for this one…there are grounds for Motions on an Emergency Basis and there are clearly ways to attempt to abuse this proviso…
        Audio tape EVERYTHING.
        Have no exchanges that are not recorded or documented and when away, keep in touch with the court.

    • At this point I don’t think it is accurate to say he was shot because of outstanding warrants. The police officer pulled him over for a burned out tail light. He apparently ran because he did not want to be arrested. I’m not sure the police officer even knew there was a warrant for his arrest. He shot him without any discussion. The video shows a blatant example of first degree murder. Outrageous!

  47. I must say, LawDiva, in all earnest, I truly hope that you never are called to the bench.
    The attitude you display towards the ‘financial punishment’ of yet another father, and the court’s enabling of yet another parasitic mother is all too frequently echoed in the family law industry.
    While every parent should contribute in an equitable manner, it also must be expected that every parent put forth an equitable effort as well. This woman was left with a large amount of money…signed off on her claims to support and had means to garner further income and yet chose to pursue her ex-husband and chain him forever to the post of her welfare.
    No one is entitled to ‘money for life’ and no one is entitled to be middle class forever. A marriage must stop being considered a contract for life. If this attitude does not change…marriage itself will continue to fall out of favour.
    To those ends, never should there be open ended awards of support.
    It is small wonder that so many otherwise ‘eligible’ bachelors refuse any commitment to a woman and no wonder so many, tired of being an ‘ATM machine’ to an otherwise capable person, elect to leave.
    A similar situation is looming on my horizon…and I am using the interim time researching second passports, flags of convenience, studying Spanish and weighing the residency requirements of non-signatory countries.

    I plan on leaving my vindictive, parasitic ex-wife an almost verbatim copy of the one Mr Mills wrote…with a post script “Hasta la vista, baby…”

  48. You people are stupid, ignorant and unrealistic.
    The system is a racket. They claim to do things in the best interest of the child. The reality is the system is build to bleed the man dry. I know an engineer who makes over 90K a year. However, he pays child support, healthcare, and childcare ( ordered by the courts) … but initiated and chosen by the mother. He is left with $546 take home pay. The irony is that the courts want to increase his payments now.

    IN Oklahoma USA, the courts can take up to 60% of one’s income for child support before taxes! In addition to this the non-custodial parent is responsible for 100% of medical and dental insurance coverages, pus 50% to 80% of any out of pocket related deductibles or fees. In addition the non-custodial parent is responsible for 50% to 80% of childcare expense ( and NO, they are not allowed to care for the child,only to pay for someone else to care for them.) NOW the real kicker is…. Federal taxes are around 40% of one’s income, and state is around 9% to 12%. So, he is facing legal recourse either way.
    A)Either pay your full support payments, and not your full taxes ( go to federal prison for non-payment of taxes.)
    B) Pay your federal taxes, and then not your full child support and go to state prison for being a dead-beat dad.

    The reality is there is no way a person making $90K (already maxing out financial earning potential) and only taking home $546 a month can be expected to live and survive in America. There is something really wrong with this world when the lazy can leach off the righteous and hardworking people.
    This man did nothing to deserve this, he was a good husband and father. His wife started using drugs ( meth), and became addicted. She eventually left him for the drugs. But that’s not a reason in OK to not give her custody. She goe the kids, the house ($240K which she sold, and kept all the money) more drugs, other men coming and going, and is promised more from the government which they intend to take from him.
    The man I speak of is a friend and co-worker. The people at work are all scared of him, because we are afraid he will snap one day and start killing people and himself. But, this is just the way the system is….
    Yet according this articles author… he is a dead beat dad…
    you should be ashamed for yourself.

    • Help him escape the country. Maybe even get some other employees/engineers to pitch in some cash. Having an Engineers degree/ skill will allow him to live very, very good in a country like the Phils. He wont have a problem getting a job. He could follow Hans Mills and try find online love and marry someone. He cannot get behind more than 2500 usa in child support or he will lose his passport escape window………………………….and then be ass raped by the ex until infinity or death

      Asylum is another option and would take time to petition other gov’ts by email and letters. A USA immigration lawyer might be able to help and possibly for free if his USA OK job has a legal services benefit. DO NOT TELL THE LAWYER YOU ARE TRYING TO DODGE CHILD SUPPORT/ALIMONY. Better to say you are being politically discriminated against. Might be best to contact a lawyer in a foreign country and ask the procedure for asylum. If the foreign lawyer is willing to help, then of course you will have to pay their fees. With Asylum he is protected by a foreign gov’t and can’t be sent back to the USA

      Anything has to be better than being extorted to the bone on 546 a month. Nelson, if he is really a good man and friend, help him out of this country.

  49. re: nelson b.’s post: OMG, I didn’t know that is possible. Can’t he just get the amounts lowered? by appeal? (Or, was I just living in a “Reader’s Digest” world all this time?)

    • Unfortunately when a lot of Men file a Motion of Change, the support order seldom ever goes down…if anything it will either be (stayed) and in a lot of Cases…raised even Higher than before! Okay…go back to your Readers Digest! lol

  50. These stories makes me think back to my childhood, i am one of those children that was held hostage in a alimony battle, so i guess you could say im the end result of all this bullshit.

    -I will NEVER get married EVER, i have had relationships come to “either we marry or we split up” twice in my life and i always chose the latter
    -It`s impossible just for me to completely trust women, if one even suggest we marry, part of me thinks she`s trying to get me into a trap
    -I had a Vasectomy at age 21, just to be in complete control of who i father a child with

    Just wait until more kids like me grow up, marriage my very well not be in your daughters future

  51. Leaving the country would be the best option for the Engineer in OK USA. Sooner or later he is going to unable to make the payments and get thrown in and out of jail like a revolving door. What about he kids you say? Well since the lady is smoking away most of the money, only a pittance will be used for the kids

    Read some online messages recently. A man from the USA east coast fled to the state of Arizona to avoid extortionate child support and alimony. For some months he appeared to live in a trailer in the desert and not working. If one does not work a job, the gov’t cannot get money from a person. For about 4 months he wrote letters or email? to various foreign nations requesting political ASYLUM from the persecuting USA gov’t He said the German gov’t accepted his ASYLUM and will protect him from the USA child support/alimony scam

    Not sure how he left the USA. Even if he has a USA passport, it is surely revoked by child support/alimony. I dont think the man was a dual citizen of 2 countries. Maybe the German govt helped him?

    No doubt the child support/alimony scam is persecution for money and can lead to the protection of Asylum from another gov’t

  52. His actions were clearly fair; she was a despicable woman who was probably laughing at the time when she thought about milking him dry.

  53. Men getting smart and not suckered is the only hope we have that this racket will stop.
    Do NOT get married…and watch the clock for the Common Law requirements in your jurisdiction.
    Only a partner who brings assets of equal value to the table, is self-sufficient in every way and is willing to sign an iron-clad prenup should be all that’s ever considered for a LTR.

  54. I must say this is a very good thread. Unfortunately I am one of the (FALLEN) and am in the arrears about $1500 USD, My child support obligation is about $324.00 USD per month i only gross $2448 USD but when everything is said and done I only take home $1100 USD per month.

    Now I know this is peanuts compared to you people who are making $100k plus per year but still its money I need to live and I to am looking at the possibility of leaving the country.

    I would love to speak with the people who have left the country and are living abroad on there own working I would like to become you’re student and learn from you I want to live a life not in fear I have already been threatened by DSHS division of child support and told that that if I do not turn in forms that he will raise my child support obligation.

    I have been told if I become delinquent that they will put a warrant out for my arrest. I am a nervous reck I am being attached at work severely mostly by immigrants and a lot of fellow Americans.

    When people see you’re weak they are curious to see how you can be pushed to see maybe if they can bring the crazy out in you.

    I want to speak with people who can educate me and give me a clear understanding I see some people go to russia czech republic ect…..

    here is my phone number call or text messages I do not care to know who you are just only know how you EXITED the country and stayed gone


    Please no crazy people only realistic truthful people

  55. If you really want a nightmare scenario, Google “Dave Foley child support” – the just of which is Dave Foley (NewsRadio, Kids in the Hall) stated that as a result of having been judicially mandated to pay his ex wife 400% (!!!) of his income in child support, he cannot return to Canada without facing imprisonment. The Judges in these cases should be imprisoned.

    • We don’t want to hear horror stories of men being destroyed by this child support sysyem.

      We know its dangerous and should be abolished

      Give us answers to escape how to move where to go how to start a new life

      Real answers no more people just chatting we are in the horror situation now and need tips steps strategies


      • @ child support slave

        I know I can’t offer any advice that may help you, but the reality is that men who are currently in the process of fleeing will be hesitant to divulge their escape route for fear that the route may be closed off. It may also draw the attention of the government to the holes through which men are leaving and prompt them to find ways of closing them, not only stopping the men who are fleeing, but also stopping men who aren’t fleeing, from going anywhere.

        I would suggest that you try to find someone who has ‘left’ and get them to mentor you on polishing your escape plan.

        I can understand your frustration because, like anything, having two million people agree with you that there’s a problem doesn’t change anything until one of those people comes up with a solution.

        The most important thing is to NOT TELL ANYONE you’re planning on leaving, lest they make your life even harder before you’ve had a chance to set anything up.

      • Well you mention good answers to some of my questions. I know everything must be a secret nobody can know or my life will seize to exist.

        Try to mention what countries don’t have extraction treaties with USA where we can find sanctuary where we can find a job live comfortable hell even if you own a vacation home in Thailand may we reuge there till we get on are feet

        Anything people help us we are child support slaves and want to escape we want to live to I want to be happy again not live in fear

  56. @child support slave

    Do not get more than 2500 USA behind in Child support or alimony or you will your passport escape window. As long as you have a job, your wages will slowly eat into the CS arrears. If you get too far behind in CS, you are stuck permanently in the USA. If you get over 2500 USA CS in arrears and then “caught up”, it will probably take at least 2 years to get the mess straightened out before you can get a passport again.

    Never discuss your life with co-workers. It may be best if you can move to another shift or another dept. to get away from bad co-workers.

    You can find information on CS treaty countries in wikipedia. The list isn’t big. Keep in mind that most all “anglosphere” nations have a CS treaty with the USA.

    You could contact a lawyer in say Thailand (or whatever nation) and ask what it takes to become a resident there. If you are willing to pay their fee, you might get fast tracked out of the country. Do not mention anything about CS. Better say you are dissatisfied with country’s policies and want a new life.

    Lets say you get hopelessly behind in CS to 30,000 USA. Your only hope would be to request political Asylum (maybe with lawyer help)

    If you have 10+ plus years to pay into this extortion racket, leaving the country may be best. CS is generally spent on the mothers self indulgence. It is nothing more than a scam for the govt to make big money under the Title IV-D act of 1975 It funds the judges and politicians salaries and retirement. Truly sick scam using kids for this

    Anyone paying forever alimony should leave the USA

    • @Basalt

      We’ll my friend you share some good advice what will happen if I leave the usa and I am unable to live in another country. And years later I return lets say I am 20,000 dollars in the hole.

      Due to child support arrears when I get to the airport in united states and customs I will be detained upon reentry ? Will I go to prison and if yes for how long.

      Also can you tell me what countries do not have extradition treaties with the united states of america and where are good places I can live where they like Americans and I can generate by working having a good job a good life.

      Iv’e been told Australia and New Zealand check with united states of america to see if you owe or cleared of any criminal history.

      My son is five years old if I stuck to pay for him it would be thirteen more years. And if his mother decides to put him in college I could be paying till he is close to twenty five years old we are talking about a good eighteen more years of paying child support. That’s the rest of my life I don’t want this

      I want to be free and not have to worry or look over my shoulder I will renounce my status as american to have a better life I want my stress to go away.

      Another question is if I leave the united states of america and become a citizen in another country. I want to travel to other parts of the world like Europe or anywhere will I be harassed anytime I go somewhere If I travel to the country that has a treaty with usa will this country deport me even for just passing through I don’t want to feel like a fugitive the rest of my life

      Give me you’re thoughts opinions if you want to speak on the phone I would be willing to do so

  57. This is my REAL TRUE Ontario Family Law case for you, with hopes of getting your opinions for me….

    My ex and I arrived in 1998 to Ontario Canada, and both became Canadian citizens 4 years later.

    We had two kids before arriving, one born in Mexico and the other one in the USA (youngest one).

    In 2010 (when we completed 20 years of marriage{we got married in Mexico}) my ex left Ontario Canada and left me, in charge of the two kids and she did hired a lawyer to get divorced. I had to do the same.

    I had to evaluate the cost of the matrimonial house and our savings and my pension, and after a lot of lawyer fees and 4 years later I had sole custody of my kids (now the oldest one is married, and only my 17 year old lives with me (as per 2015), she was then11 years old at the time of separation).

    My divorce happen just last year in Feb 2014…. yes 4 years later ($$$$)…..

    My ex never call the kids for Xmas or sent them a card or present, she did not even attend my oldest one wedding two years ago. She only came once to see her lawyer, and spend 1 hour with my youngest one. Never have contacted or sees my youngest one….. and I had nothing to do with it.

    In 2010, I did handle to remortgage to keep up with the alimony and expenses imposed to us (the kids and I) and keep the matrimonial home and pay for my now married kid university, as she was going through first year of university at the time of separation, I think you guys can see I was going through divorce proceedings, and even when in no fault, it was hard, and I know it has been even harder for many of you… (FYI I do not own a big house $200K approx and drive a MY2000 car for transportation)….

    I have been paying $1,500 Cad per month in alimony, I have never missed one single payment,
    I have never missed feeding and supporting my two kids and I do love them a lot.
    Even when my ex left the country without even telling us in advance (as she went to live in Can Cun mexico, where she lives with the younger boyfriend she left with), her family is very wealthy (that is why she lives in Can Cun), but my lawyers do not even respond now to my eMails when I ask if after paying 5 years of alimony I can go to ask for a revised amount…. my ex is a lawyer and she is capable of working in Mexico, and her family owns a law firm there too…. yet for Canada, she is a NON working spouse and I should keep supporting her indefinitely … is any lawyer here that can suggest to me what to do to reduce the alimony? I make $100K per year and they impose her $20K, her family will inherit her millions of dollars in few more years, but I gave her my penssion in order to keep supporting my kids…. Amy toughs?
    according with Family Law I suppose to keep giving her alimony until I retire?

    Your advise is appreciated.

    • There is a BC case, where a lawyer is seeking to stop support payments after age 65 .. anybody know the “math” of age-vs-support obligations?

      Or, is it a “life sentence”?

      • So long as the payor has income, that is not derived from previously divided assets, and the recipient has need or was awarded “compensatory” support, support will continue past age 65. I acted for one client who at 72 was still paying his ex-wife. He was in a catch-22. He had to keep working so as not to be in contempt of an $8,000 a month spousal support order (he was a self-employed doctor). Eventually, the court cut his payments in half and he later negotiated the termination of support with his ex who was 17 years younger and a professional woman with income of $75,000 per annum.

    I supported my ex through his education
    I supported my ex through his Naval Career and his civilian career
    I supported my ex by taking care of his children(without me caring for our kids his naval career would not have been near impossible as a single parent)
    When he asked me to leave MY military career to take care of our kids I gave in.
    When he asked me to leave MY healthcare jobs that i had throughout our marriage to take care of the kids so that he can pursue a civilian career with a hectic schedule I GAVE IN.
    When he asked me to drain the savings account i had from my single years (which later served as our emergency funds) from my previous jobs so we can pay credit cards because his spending was out of control I GAVE IN.
    I did the family laundry, cleaning, cooking (because he wouldn’t since he was too busy tinkering with his antique car). He also spent very little time with his boys because after all, in his mind, “mom” (me) can take care of them.
    HE got was home by 4PM daily and “relaxed” or went out with friends. I worked until midnight and up by 5am the next day. No social life for me.

    My reward?: A husband who cheated on me numerous times throughout our marriage.
    A middle aged husband who told a judge in the midst of our divorce that he couldn’t pay ANY child or spousal support because there wouldn’t be enough money left for his 20 year old MISTRESS who had expensive taste and who he MOVED IN(against court orders) to our home a week after i MOVED into a tiny apartment with my two boys.
    He felt that since i returned to work (to a low paying job which was all i could find during the economic downturn) that i should be able to handle supporting his kids (which were in daycare so that i can work) on my own.

    A man who blamed ME for our divorce because, as he put it (in front of male lawyers) i wouldn’t let him continue his affair and accept his latest mistress moving in with us so that he can keep the marriage intact, while maintaining his mistress under the same roof.

    When the judge asked me how i was managing i pulled out paperwork showing that i was borrowing money from everywhere just to survive. At that point i still had no furniture, just beds for my kids ( i slept on the floor on a blanket).
    Meanwhile my ex is taking trips with his teenie bopper girlfriend to Hawaii and other states unbeknowst to me on OUR JOINT credit card ( i had cancelled all of them before i moved out except for one that i had no idea he still had ( he told me he had cancelled it the year before and it was a card i never used).
    Yes the paper-trail of his deeds were long–including paying for LUXURY APARTMENT for his mistress on our joint accounts(before i cancelled them) and wanted to make ME responsible for HER apartment COSTS!
    He then had the GALL ask me to pay half of the BILL for our JOINT Account so he could keep treating his Mistress NICE THINGS.

    At that point i just wanted to be quick to extricate the ex husband out of my life so —
    I agreed to only 4 years of spousal support (eventhough i was entitled to a quarter of his military retirement pay-remember i am trying to protect the emotional wellbeing of my kids by preventing years of drawn out court battle)
    left him the 250k house with everything in it, only got a tiny portion of the equity while he got all the debts on credit cards most of which he had used with other women.
    In spite of my making only $10.00/hour at the time, and his salary close to $100K, his child support ended up being a little over $500.00/month for TWO kids ( daycare cost $700/month for one) and a $200/month spousal support. My so called spousal support ended up going ENTIRELY to the kids. Though we had joint legal custody (i had physical) the kids were with me 80% of the time (thank God for that) which made my cost of living/surviving higher than his.

    My ex was GIDDY when he came out of that mediation room and raced home to give the “good news” to his mistress turned girlfriend of how he “won” everything–the house, the contents, kept his retirement intact, got to keep his 401K, IRAs (which were supposed to be in both our names) in tact etc. To celebrate they took a trip to the Caribbean the following week.
    How do i know what he said and what he did? My teenager at the time who was staying with him for a few days told me when he was dropped off so my ex can go on that Caribbean cruise with his bimbo.

    The biggest IRONY? Eventhough i was dead broke i was RELIEVED and actually HAPPY to get him out of my life.

    I knew i would be broke for while but would be ok because i was DRIVEN and didn’t stop pushing until i landed a $45K job (which i calculated is what i would need to raise my kids without his child support charity) two years later. I had to sacrifice a lot of time with my kids in order to work multiple jobs. What saved me is that i was very Frugal, driven, and my prayers.

    as for the Ex husband? Well for the two years i was scrapping he was spending money on his teenie bopper girlfriend like it was going out of style. At the end of those two years he was facing a $100k debt, bankruptcy and foreclosure.
    When he told his missy that they would have to sell the house and move into a tiny apartment she left him. Yep, miss “i love you not your money” dumped my ex for another MARRIED MAN with MORE money.
    He later found out that she had been leeching off of MULTIPLE married middle aged men (easier targets because most are looking for young vaginas according to her) whose marriages she had helped destroy and when they found themselves broke, she walked.

    HOw do i know this? Because my ex came crying (yes real tears) to my door on his birthday to tell me that he would be late on child support and when i took him to get some coffee because i didnt want our kids to see him like that (he was a real mess, unshaven, unshowered, dirty etc)
    He told me the whole story of what she had been doing for the last two years and how she ended up leaving him for another man taking with her-his dog, his things, and all the money he had in bank accounts.
    Then he APOLOGIZED for treating me (the only woman that had genuinely treated him decently) like Sh*T. He lost his job, filed bankruptcy and almost lost the house.
    But did he learn? Nope. For the next 8 years he continued to hook up with women that have cheated on him, stolen from him, treated him like crap, have been in prison for drugs, have mental issues etc. His world has spiraled into depravity.

    As for myself and the kids? Well i have been in a relationship for 7 years with a man that treats me like a woman should be treated and who treats my kids like his own. We were married 4 years ago.
    Our mortgage is about to be paid off in full thanks to a trust that my grandfather left for me when i was little (i am now 48) and which i never even knew existed until recently when my parents told me after the sale of my grandfather’s estate.
    I have zero credit card debt (haven’t owned a credit card in 10 years), zero auto loan since i paid off my car 3 years ago after landing another great job, zero student loan since my grandfather’s estate paid the remaining balance a few weeks ago. If that hadn’t happened i was on tract to pay the remaining in the next two years from my savings.
    One more thing, though i am not Religious attending church every Sunday, but rather more spiritual—
    I never forgot to thank GOD throughout my darkest days.
    I thanked him for getting me out of a miserable marriage even though i ended up dead broke.
    I thanked him for allowing me to marry my ex so that i could one day learn the difference between a lousy husband and a good husband.
    I thanked GOD for all the blessings he has bestowed on our family, even when we had little.
    I thanked GOD for the struggles because in those struggles there were valuable lessons to learn and yes even miracles.
    I thanked GOD for the strength he gave me to get through some very dark periods.
    I also asked for forgiveness and asked him to remove hate and anger from my heart.
    My prayers were answered–not in the ways i imagined they would but in ways that, in the end, would end up serving my family better.
    I witnessed alot of “ironic” moments which made me realize they were miracles at work and thanked him for being with me always.
    Eventhough my life is amazing right now, I have not forgotten to continue to thank him.

    Oh and NO money in the world is worth abandoning your kids. I would rather live in out of a car if that was my only option,than abandon my kids. And i would have parked that car right in the street right front of my ex’s house just so that i could see my kids (if he had majority custody).

    By the way Georgialee what happened to that man was ABUSIVE. No one should be allowed leave their ex DESTITUTE just so they can collect beyond what is reasonable and FAIR.

    • It is easy to say that you would never abandoning your kids. If your wife takes you to the cleaners full scale … taking all the money you earned and extorting custody or even child visitation (that she controls anyways; an uphill battle) for future alimony and child support etc. I love my son more that anything but should I become the slave of my wife as this has been described on this page?

      • Agreed. Some do “get off” on the false moral high ground. If you cannot support your self and put a roof over your head, how can you be a father to your kid? Simply put, you can’t. Working extra hours or 2 jobs (on the books) to try and support your kid and live will only allow the nasty cupcake to receive even more money from you. Easy to pay double CS.

        Sure you can pay a lawyer to fight custody and lose anyway. Big waste of of time and money to fight a rigged court. As a man, be ready lose in court.

        Should you “chump up” and decide to pay the Ex for 18 yrs, be ready for those nasty court letters if you lose your job They really get off their A$$ fast once the CS gravy train stops. They dont care about kids or visitation rights. There is no money in that. The CS court only cares about the gold in your wallet

        If I had years and decades to pay CS and/or alimony, I would leave the country. Being stressed for life and paying a parasite will only allow the ex to live the high life. You won’t be able to have a life economically and could be in and out of jail, assuming you can’t make payments for whatever reason. Most people don’t make the same salary forever. Paying alimony in this day and age is a crock of BS. Those feminazis want to have have their cake and eat it too. Feminazis say they dont need a man, but they do want/need his money. Alimony should be banned in all forms. It only makes one side an economic slave. People need to move on and not be tied to their exes welfare forever. Divorce 50/50 of assets and be done 100%. Too much common sense here with court money greed clouding judgement

  59. @child support slave

    Will post more thoughts this weekend. If you leave the USA, it will have to be forever. Unless these Nazi laws change………you have to stay exiled. If you re-enter the USA with new citizenship (say Thai), its possible you could be detained and jailed. I do not know what would happen if you went to Canada with a new citizenship (say Thailand) and tried to enter that country. Its likely nothing will happen. Better to be safe and avoid those countries with USA CS treaties

    Like Hans Mills the bill keeps piling up at 4000 a month plus interest. Sure the debt is un payable. It will never stop accruing and mounting. Your CS bill would still be there if you returned to the USA. Don’t risk it.

  60. I don’t have an issue with Child Support, I think it should be natural to want to help your kids regardless. What I do have an issue with Spousal maintenance I agree there should be a period for which they support should continue, but the whole paying maintenance until death sounds stupid (I am talking about UK law). I see a lot of parents here considering moving abroad to avoid payments and start their lives over again, then I read about (REMO), does REMO cover (Child support payments Only) OR does (REMO also enforces Spousal maintenance if you are abroad?).

    Anyone has any knowledge on this subject?

    • Guys any feedback on this? Much appreciated I am weighting my options. Any input will be very much appreciated.

      • Be creative! Have you a physical injury that could, at anytime, force you out of work? SS can go both ways… Can you impute a wage on her? Maybe offer 3 years tuition and support so that she can get on her own two (perfectly good) legs… Should there not be a solution, a second passport or residency elsewhere…

  61. @child support slave

    If you live in one of the following USA states CA,AL,HI,IA,IN,IL,MA,NY,NJ,MO,CT,MS,OR,WA, you will be forced to pay college costs in addition to CS. It does not matter if you are married or not. It does not matter whether or not you can afford the tuition. You will be forced to take out loans if possible. One way or another, the state will force you to pay. Most states cap the college tuition costs at normal in-state college costs. If junior decides to go to Harvard, you should only have to pay 1/2 (typically) the tuition cost of an in state university. Mom and junior are supposed to pay the remaining half of college. Some states throw in the cost of a car, car insurance, computer, room and board, books, car insurance, money allowance, cell phone, etc. as part of college expenses. In those cases, junior gets a debt free ride. Many fathers simply don’t have the money after divorce and pay CS to 23 yrs or so. From the stories I have read, the NC parent (mostly dad) ends up paying 70% plus of all the college expenses

    Dads are only supposed to be ATMs for the kids. They are not supposed to enjoy life or have any chance at retirement. Hard to live and enjoy life when all dad does is slave away at work. Its all on dear old dad to sacrifice. Mom typically gets a free pass in all this and can do no wrong. In the courts and exes view, its not wrong if dad never has chance to retire right???

    CS slave—-if you stay in the USA, you can be sure cup cake (your ex) will take you to the cleaners and force you to pay for college. By 2028 College costs will be at least 150,000 minimum. If you put in other misc. college expenses plus child support, the cost will easily be in the 250,000 plus range over 4 yrs. In the end, you will foot most of the bill. Yes you would likely pay forever unless winning the lottery

    The biggest contradiction is that married couples can refuse to pay for college and junior is on his own. Divorced or never married couples can be forced to pay college in some USA states. This is discrimination against never married couples, but the law is ignored in those states.

    England, Canada, New Zeeland, and Australia are places you probably should not visit.

    DO NOT WORK a 2nd job on the books if you need more money. If you are found by the courts (they do 3 yr reviews) to have a 2nd income, they can easily double your CS for one kid. Work off the books if you want additional money. Its almost impossible to lower CS once it has been raised. Your new level of CS can easily be 650+ usa monthly.

    Try to live cheaply and meagerly until you can leave (maybe live with parents, relatives, or friends)

    Can be contacted luker1001@hotmail.com (spam will be blocked and deleted)

      • @ Scott

        The information is not hard to find through search engines. Better to list the nations not safe for CS debt

        ***Hague Convention of Treaty on Recovery of International CS and HR 1896***

        Australia, Canada, Czech., El Salvador, Finland, Hungary, Ireland, Israel, Netherlands, Norway, Poland, Slovak. Rep, Switzerland, and the U.K

        ***Hague Convention on International Recovery of CS and other forms of Family Maintenance***

        Albania, European Union (Except UK and Denmark), Norway, Ukraine

        Keep in mind that any USA state can try to pursue a CS or alimony case anywhere in the world. Your chances might be best if you can get Asylum or go to any nation not on these lists. Some USA states may have agreements on HR 1896 with other foreign nations in addition to those listed. Its up to you to check out the laws in your state.

        Keep in mind that everything I have written has not been “battle tested.” Yet, there must be some truths to the stories of people fleeing this extortion racket. Hopefully the research and suggestions can help someone

  62. Whoah thiѕ blog is fantastic… i love reading yоur posts.
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  63. @Basalt

    We’ll this information is useful. I knew about paying child support up until the child was 24 years old but I did not know about paying the tution expenses.

    250,000 is a house a very nice house. If I am trapped paying this type of money that’s too much as it looks right now I will be paying 50,000 but I am sure my salary will not stay the same

    Basalt I will contact you for more advice you seem to know about this stuff I assume you suffered from the same child support slavery as us.

    • @ CS slave

      Keep in mind this assumes Junior will actually go to college in 13 yrs. Once those vindictive exes get a taste of that CS gravy train, they will want to keep the gravy pouring in as long as possible. She is sure to “encourage” junior to go to college for the benefit of his “future.” Even when junior is 18+ yrs in age, the CS will go to mom to spend as she pleases. CS won’t stop during those summer months, when junior is not in college. The judge won’t allow the CS to go to junior

      The states that force non-married or divorced people to pay college have different variations on how long you pay college. I heard in New Jersey that its possible junior could screw around and flunk courses for a time and you still pay for it——- plus the CS time is extended. Usually a student must maintain a certain GPA to continue the college pay law. So if junior flunks out for 1 year, then you might get a reprieve and the insanity might stop. However family court is a crap shoot, and “it depends on the judge” on whether not the CS and college pay stop

      Also it is possible for junior to sue you for college expenses or even sue both you and the ex. I don’t think kids are entitled to a free ride or near free ride to college. Life changes for bad sometimes and people need money to cover medical or put food on the table.

      The courts don’t care if salary stays same or not. They impute your income on it——–like your salary always stays the same. Yet an ex (the female typically) does not have her income imputed. They will adjust to her benefit if she quit working or collects state welfare. All for the states money coffers to extort you for more

      • Forgot to add Junior could flunk out 1 year of college and the judge could decide junior “deserves” a 2nd chance to succeed. Its also possible junior could take 5-6 years to graduate, if he goes that route. All the while the CS gravy train is relentless on top of tuition payments. Basing my assumptions on NJ college pay law

        In my state, there is no college pay law. A man is free once the kid is 18 yrs or graduates high school. If the kid flunks a grade or two, it is possible CS can go to 19.5 years maximum

        If you are divorcing, DO NOT AGREE TO PAY COLLEGE in the divorce settlement. You don’t know what college expenses will be in the future. And if junior goes to an Ivy league school, be prepared to pony up the funds. Its about 47,000-50,000 a year on tuition alone in 2015-2016. Even if you do not live in a college pay state, the ex can try to use “college cost” in a way to extort you to settle in a divorce agreement. If you agree in a divorce settlement to pay college expenses, you will be forced to pay by the state by any means necessary.

        Its possible you could cap college to TUITION ONLY to 5000 a year in the divorce settlement. Using vague words in an agreement to words like “college expenses” could mean you pay everything from a car, 1000 a month abode, money allowance, tuition, books, and fees. Do not be vague in college payment language or a judge could add 100k to 200k in “extras” over 4 yrs, if you only want to pay some of juniors college

  64. The legal system here in the united stats is anti-male for sure. If your a father and the wife files for support, your screwed, and become nothing more then an employed and economic slave to the state and the x-wife who enjoys seeing you financially raped.

  65. I loved this blog. It is very clear that mostly everyone here is full of anger, indignation and frustration. Venting and sharing our horror stories is good, but I have also been looking into how to change things. I’m not a lawyer or a politician, but something clearly needs to be done. I recently found a group of people who seem to be pretty dedicated to changing the law and/or suing individual states for violating constitutional rights, such as the freedom to choose your career. If you’re interested, check them out here:

    A quick summary on my story: I make 113K per year in the U.S. and got ordered to pay $48,600 per year to an ex (30K is alimony). She doesn’t work and has no plans to work ever. She poisoned my children with heavy parental alienation tactics and my older daughter won’t even talk to me. I’ve spent all of my time, energy and money fighting in court (on my 3rd lawyer now), but it is hopeless. The ex is relentlessly fighting for even more money, and she may actually get it.

    Like many others here, I’m beyond depressed, angry and frustrated. It is easy to understand why so many divorces end in suicide or murder. In any case, I have a dual-citizenship and have been thinking really hard about living the county. The only reason I haven’t yet is because I do have a 9-year old who still comes to my house and likes my company. I can’t bear the thought of her mom telling her that “dad ran away to another country and abandoned you”.

    Regarding the issue of child support, I’m “ok” with the idea of child support, but the problem is that it is way off base. In reality, child support doesn’t come even close to the real cost of raising a child. Instead, child support is a *major* profit center! Do you want to put most of the family court lawyers out of a job? Just change the law to a default 50/50 custody arrangement and make child support reasonable, based on real costs. In other words, remove the profitability from children.

    Again, I hope more of us can get involved and try to end this terrible slavery. Check the forum above. If you’re want to get even more pissed off, watch the “Divorce Corp” documentary.

  66. That amount is ridiculous, on top of her getting most of the belongings. I don’t blame him for leaving the country. Let

  67. Here’s one for ya’s….FMEP seized bank account , suspended Class 1 drivers licence (my main form of income)and truck insurance. And a lot more other crap. Finally went to court , and proved I’m the one owed over $9200. Daughter lives with me now for the last year, and was in court 2 months ago for a conference with the ex and judge , judge postpones case for 3 month no support to be paid to me and FMEP will not go and collect monies owed,,, Total scumbags.

  68. This blog and replies seem all American/Canadian. I’m an immigrant in the UK (now British), who’s sacrificed the better life in my developing but yet much more pleasant country of origin to nurture the love I found in UK. My problem however is that I’ve caught my wife researching divorce twice now. And she keeps giving endless signs that she’s not really into this marriage thing again. She’s not worked since she finished uni (we married when she’s still studying); I’ve been working (employed) part time and running my business full time. Not rich but pay the rent, bills, holidays, etc without fail. My main worry is: how do I live should we separate. We have a demanding child maintenance system here as well but not that unfair. I can easily steal my own kids and run away with them to where I can comfortably raise them with top class upbringing and education. (I’m educated to matters level with loads of professional certifications). But I can’t imagine my kids living without their mum and dad together.
    May seem totally out of what you were all discussing but any advise please?

    • Scared Husband::

      Here’s my advice to you:

      1. From a financial perspective, if you know that your marriage will fail and it’s just a matter a time, it’s better do to it sooner than later, when you’re still making less money. I waited way too long, until I reached the top of my career to get a divorce, which resulted in absurd payments to the ex. Biggest mistake ever.

      2. From a child raising perspective, I’ve found, the hard way, that younger children do adapt much easier than older children. My 9 year old took the divorce relatively well, while my 13 year old was and still is crushed.

      3. Forget the ideal of taking the children and running away to another country. Most countries have sign the Hague convention and will extradite “kidnapped” children.

      4. For everyone: get involved and try to promote change. Sign petitions and/or support groups that advocate for 50/50 default child custody and the elimination of alimony based retirement.



  69. Appears the author is another vile feminist pig

    And this: “Ms. Mill’s alleged inability to work.” (A.k.a. laziness)


    Morally bankrupt courts should stop awarding custodies to lazy females who are unwilling to support even themselves, let alone children. If that man had received custodt this would not have happened.

    • If you bothered to read a few other posts you would find that I actively lobby, speak and write in favour of shared parenting, speak and write against indefinite spousal support, decry unreasonably onerous child support, despise persons who make false allegations of sexual abuse, and have a sterling reputation as a female lawyer who does not believe all men are scum. I also believe the family justice system is in chaos and needs urgent reform. What are you doing to change the system? Posting anonymous insults? See my articles on Huffington Post, Postmedia, Lawyers Weekly, etc.

      • LawDiva….Then please satiate everyone’s curiosity and address why you opened this thread with the clear inference that Mr Mills is ‘scum’ …when he is clearly being legally raped..? Please put forth a reasonable defence of this parisitic, shiftless ex-wife who drove him to take such extreme action…

  70. These men that leave the country to avoid supporting the children they created are nothing but Cowards. There is no reason what so ever a Real Man leaves his children, and over Money. Seems as though both the Wife and Husband are both selfish. Please tell me this a joke. No wonder the kids in this world have such issues and seek acceptance anyway they can get it. I have worked with older children for years who have suffered every kind of abuse but when you dig deep you see how the abandonment from their fathers is always the event that triggers the start of the emotional inner turmoil. Yes the courts are very unfair and Men for the most part are treated poorly but this is the most selfish and unforgiving thing a man can do to innocent children. Sorry but it would be only right if these kids reject them when their dads finally reach out to them.

    • @Winston

      What a joke of a post. When Hans Mills got hit the the revised corrupt court order, he would have had to pay retroactive spousal support, lawyer costs from 2005, and his and Donna Mills lawyer for 2012. Paying 4000 a month CS+Alimony+retroactive support+layer fees would have left him with zero. Figure 50k retro spousal support plus arrears and lawyer fees. He would have been hit with at least 75k in the hole plus the 4k a month indenture. HE WOULD HAVE ZERO MONEY TO LIVE ON, EVEN IF HE PAID THE EXTORTION INDENTURE.

      If a man can’t pay for food or put a roof over his head, he sure as hell can’t be a father to his kids on zero money. If he stayed in Canada with the revised agreement, he would have been thrown in and out of jail within the year. We know how vindictive Donna Mills can be, since she tried to get the FRO to take away his passport in order to A$$ rape the guy for life long indenture. He would not have been able to see or have a relationship with his kids in this scenario anyway. Hans Mills does care for his kids and was up to date on his child support until leaving in Nov 2012. From the Star paper post, she has brainwashed the kids with deadbeat dad propaganda. No doubt she has “child alienated” the kids from Hans Mills. More fair to say Hans is a “beat dead dad” by the parasite FRO and the greedy vindictive mom.

      No matter what Hans Mills does, he is just a POS to you. He can do no right and has no right to move on and be happy in life.

      1.) If he stays in Canada and pays the indenture, he would soon not see his kids anyway (assuming Ms. Mills allows it) and end up homeless and harassed by her and the FRO for money. Eventually in and out of jail due to no money. So far Winston your the only hero implying to pay the 4k extortion plus fee, so the kids can live in a 1.2 million home. And you can live homeless. No doubt you will reply in obtuse fashion saying “for the kids” While this act is noble in saying it. Most people like yourself would not follow through and wimp out

      2.) He goes to the Philippines for a chance at life, other than being a paycheck for Ms. Mills. He can’t see his kids in this way either, but he is free from indentured servitude. At least he wont be in the poor house and see his kids one day. When the kids grow up, they will get his side of the story and hopefully reconcile. Or at the very least be on speaking terms.

      Winston if you want a better scenario for men like Hans Mills, stop condoning the extortion courts which cater to liars, lazy a$$es and deadbeats like Ms. Mills. THE MAN HAD NO CHOICE BUT TO RUN OR BE A PAYCHECK TO LAZY GREEDY EX UNTIL HE DIES

      Hans Mills is a hero in my book for standing up to the corrupt court and evil ex

    • Winston…Stop being a Simp and a White Knight. I guarantee that you would do a full 180 degree turn…if you were subjected to this System! Most Dads do not want to abandon their Children. The Current Scheme destroys them financially, and lays waste to any chance of living normally again. So…out of desperation, they leave! Hoping that later on…they may re-connect under different and better circumstances. Their Exes would have probably engaged in Parental Alienation anyways…which is what I have been putting up with for 5+ Years now! BTW Winston. What quantifies you to decide what a (Real Man) or for that matter (Coward). Guys are fast learning now to Shrug Off the Shaming Language and Tactics that are too often used to manipulate and exploit them! You can brush it off now, all that you want. But until your Head ends up in the Noose like many of us here have, and you see for yourself what really goes on (Question Mark). No Winston…this is NO JOKE.

      • Darrin G

        Man I don’t think anybody could have said that better that exactly without a doubt what it is. An person like Winston who never had to face the wrath of the child support system to only talk about how we are bad father. Believe me the wrath of this child support system will bring you down to you’re knees. Every word that Darrin G speaks is exactly what’s happened to me these. The female has to much power in the united states of America. If we are to survive this holocaust we must ban together





  71. Guys, I have a question!
    We all know the consequences of not paying child support!
    What about not paying (as decided by the judge in trial) the x amount of money from your 401k or alimony IF (!) you are out of state? How will my ex squeeze me? What tools can she deploy IF I am in a different state? I need to evaluate my options …..

    Thanks to all of you!

  72. @Charlie

    I dont know how fast court orders are enacted for 401k. But it does not matter if you are in a different USA state should they know where your 401k plan is. Running state to state won’t help as the courts only need wire intercept at the source.

    It may be too late to save your 401k from the ex. If you can get out of the USA with 401k intact, so much the better

    If you quit the USA under those circumstances owing alimony debt, you can never return to the USA. Transferring money over seas could be an option for the 401k, if you can do this fast enough. Contact a lawyer in a foreign country and ask residency requirements and maybe get a fast tracked out of the USA.

    No doubt if I was paying forever Alimony, I sure as hell would run like Hans Mills

    Again it may be too late to save all your 401k. But I sure as hell would run from forever alimony and/or extortionate amounts of CS. If you can’t leave the USA quickly, save some cash and try to leave as soon as you are able

  73. I’m Mexican but I have always wondered what would happen to me if I marry an American woman, get an American passport (a free ticket to become a criminal) and then divorce and be required to pay alimony?
    Could I just move back to Mexico and ignore the American courts? What kind of pressure would I receive? Can they cease my assets and freeze my account in Mexico?
    I live very frugal, I currently work as a freelance and I don’t even pay taxes in Mexico, I don’t even know if I should under my freelance situation but the Mexican IRS is very incompetent and they don’t seem to care, I have never even received payment notices. Thus I wonder if I would ever could be forced somehow to pay alimony to a foreign English-speaking woman. Just out of curiosity. See, not having American citizenship is not all that bad.

    • @K

      Any USA state can try to pursue an alimony or CS case in another country. With all the legal red tape, the results are generally not successful unless the country is on one of the lists for reciprocal agreements with the USA.

      The key is giving up your USA citizenship. You could go to a USA embassy in Mexico and renounce USA citizenship & possibly be stateless (citizen of no country) With the way Mexico runs, you could probably “buy” Mexico citizenship again or marry a Mexico national.

      There are no alimony or CS laws that I know about in Mexico. The court system and IRS there is very lax and doubt they would pursue you. In many countries Alimony and CS is not an extraditable crime, In most cases if you have citizenship in a foreign country with no reciprocal agreements with the USA, your assets and well being appear to be untouchable (like in Hans Mills Case)

      Once matters go international, the laws of that foreign land are paramount over any USA laws and many international laws.

      Not a lawyer and only putting in my 2 cents. Hope this will help someone :)

  74. I am the loving partner of an exceptionally wonderful man, father, and former stay-at-home dad. He is currently being forced to live in abject poverty, not to mention subjected to parental alienation and almost daily harassment by his attorney ex (along with her attorney, who is her mother). This is all happening with the full knowledge and blessing of the IL, U.S. court system.

    I have been shocked by what I’ve seen him go through and appalled to discover that his is not an isolated case. I am a freelance writer and am working on a book about how the U.S. family court system is failing and crippling fathers.

    If you have a story to share, one that you can back up with evidence, please contact me with a summary at deadbeatenintosubmission@gmail.com. I will reach out to people down the road for interviews. All identifying information will be changed or omitted from the book and I am working with a lawyer to develop a contract specifying as much before I conduct interviews.

    While I sympathize with the Canadians, I am looking for US-based stories at this time.

    Please note that I am female and I understand some of you no longer trust my kind, understandably so. My partner has also expressed that he would also be willing to conduct interviews if you’d rather talk to a male (and one who has been through his own nightmare!)

    • Kate Your book is sorely needed, as most people have no idea of the abuse and trauma visited on many fathers who only want to be a good parent. I am sure you will receive many responses. You may also wish to contact Leading Women for Shared Parenting, (LW4SP.com) a US non-profit that is doing amazing work in this area. Disclaimer: I am a member of LW4SP.

      • Hi Georgialee, I have a friend in a similar situation as Andy. He is paying up to 40% of his gross earnings for child support and not making enough money to even pay his rent. He cannot afford to pay for a lawyer to challenge the court order but he is willing to pay when he gets a reduction on his garnishment order. Any advice for him?

      • LawDiva…..Still awaiting your defense of Ms Mills…..till then, all your ‘above’ has the aire of hypocracy…

    • Kate,

      I really admire your initiative. Thank you for doing this. I will contact you with my personal never-ending horror story.


  75. So as you can see, the female who wrote this article blames the man yet fails to see that he gave his EX 90% of his assets which she probably spent on clothes; she was given a 1.2 million house and says she won’t give up fighting for her children, well, can’t she just sell the mansion, move to a smaller house and live off the money difference? Can’t she work?

    Like always, they expect the man to do everything for them. This man would have ended with little over $2000 per month after paying child support and alimony, I think he made a good decision to let the bitch handle the burden of her stupid decisions, I don’t think the children will actually be living on the street like the author implies: If she manages her fortune well, works her ass as she should and even get help from the government (which she will) then why is she bitching? She ruined this man’s life, I would have done the same.

  76. I can’t say it any better than this:

    “So as you can see, the female who wrote this article blames the man yet fails to see that he gave his EX 90% of his assets which she probably spent on clothes; she was given a 1.2 million house and says she won’t give up fighting for her children, well, can’t she just sell the mansion, move to a smaller house and live off the money difference? Can’t she work?

    Like always, they expect the man to do everything for them. This man would have ended with little over $2000 per month after paying child support and alimony, I think he made a good decision to let the bitch handle the burden of her stupid decisions, I don’t think the children will actually be living on the street like the author implies: If she manages her fortune well, works her ass as she should and even get help from the government (which she will) then why is she bitching? She ruined this man’s life, I would have done the same.”

  77. Been a nasty 8 years in the USA with Obama the Osama and that horrible high deductable/cost of socialist Obamacare. That guy is a lazy liberal do nothing. He has remarked some things to effect of fathers need to do more and the courts need do better. Of course the Osama coward won’t do anything for fear of losing the female vote for Democrats

    Having been through the divorce court system twice, there might be a chance Trump (assume he wins) will do something about this Nazi court regime without over sight. People are fed up with this status quo with special interests running the show. The liberal politically correct media is spinning most negatively about Trump. It must mean those little boys are scared by what they can’t control and polls say he is winning

    Merely speculation if Trump wins and has Jesse Ventura as his running mate. Seems Trump has a good shot as people are tired of “same old, same old” do nothing established career politicians. Term limits would stop much of this.

    Hope the day comes when Trump say to all the court judges and worthless CS agents “you’re fired”

    • If the democratic system actually worked, the US Congress wouldn’t have a 15% approval rating. No one you vote for isn’t corrupt or corrupted by the system, and no one who isn’t will get elected. Canada, New Zealand, etc not any better, as seen.

      At least in the past, one had certain rights, as in the Bill of Rights, which are only your rights as long as they are convenient for the government to let you have them. (e.g. Patriot Act, No-Knock Warrants, spying).

      Even the basis assumptions are flawed “The right to govern is granted by the consent of the governed.” Try withdrawing consent, and you will be imprisoned or murdered. The “social contract” concept is not a contract at all, since it is a “contract” under duress. Money rules the system, not rights, and the bloated bureaucracies benefit materially from the divorce/child-support industrial complex.

      I don’t know about the Canadian system, but in the past it was envisioned by some that the US system at some point in the future would grow corrupt and need to be toppled. The system is biased, corrupt, unfair, and well-equipped and financed on the back of those who do the work. The only realistic option a person has is to vote with their feet and leave the country, since voting in a booth is laughable.

  78. Well you see what happens when feminism is prioritized by bureaucracy and not egalitarianism. If children were really the priority of the court systems, they would enforce 50% physical custody. The real priority is socialism and enforcing a perverse gynocracy.

    The West is in decline. It was killed by greed, materialism, sexual promiscuity, gluttony (witness all the fat people) and moral relativism.

    I ask the feminists this question: if you crap on the men, do you still expect them to enthusiastically fight for you, when a less feminist culture like Islam starts to encroach? Heck, I’m an atheist and I’d probably switch sides and convert to Islam rather than fight for the people who want to enslave me.

    • Not trying to waive topics from the main one over here, but guess what Robert, i’m a muslim and my ex wife were a muslim too (a muslim of birth, by name, by roots, i.e. Not a converted one) When we married, we married on the islamic shari’a and her father was a witness on that, but the wedding was on a US soil.

      But when it came to a divorce, it all became a $$ issue for the ex.

      The islamic shari’a covers and clearly defines everything already at the mattiage certificate, what the wife will get, the husban… etc whenever a divorve happens, God forbid.

      Well, i offered my ex way MORE than what we agreed upon already, but she sold her soul to the devil and abused the US system ; not only to get more, but to get everything.

      I literally stuggled for over 2 years when i left the US. But everything you do, will come back to you one way or another.

      It turned out i’ve made the good decision and i dodged that bullet.

      Now i’m married to a lovely real muslim gorgious wife, have a much better job than the US one and things could’ve never been better for me.

      Justice; my friend, has to be served in this life or in the afterlife; else nothing will ever make any sense.

      • If I may ask, which country did you end up going to?

        I have completed my equipment list (very specific now, I just copy & paste link then click “add to cart”) I’m currently figuring out a time table of things to do before leaving in Excel (which starts with 1st date of not paying the mortgage and ends with the plane flight).

        I’m considering places where the central government and prying eyes are not as obtrusive, such as Northern Iraq (the Kurdish areas) but away from where ISIS is operating. A last resort would be caves, such as are in the Zagros mountains north of Sorani, but I’m first considering the abandoned villages closer to the Turkish border, preferably where the PKK is not operating. I’d bring enough gold (purchased by credit card) to pay for 20-25 years of food, costing in that area about $1800/yr and move into an abandoned building in an abandoned village, but within close enough range of a small city like Sorani.

        That would be my retirement. I’d have a few things to entertain me: writing implements, chessboard, my complete work of Shakespeare book, and an ocarina. I will have enough equipment to hunt and fish on top of the occasional city market visit, so I’m more concerned with forms of entertainment.

        Are there any good areas in the region (between Morocco and India) besides where I’m considering that would be good for laying low in on the minimal budget I am bringing with me? (only enough for food & replacement clothing long term)

  79. It is Hans Mills that is “morally bankrupt”.

    No, he is not. You want the kids (and get the home), you pay the costs. Kids want to stay with their Mom, they should rely on her.

    “I am a woman” justification is bs and I do not give crap to it.

  80. @Robert, you have my deepest sympathy. There is always a light by end of the dark tunnel.

    Looks like you have done your research, well-done your homework & already put a plan altogether. But this doesn’t mean it’s a good plan to execute.

    The circumstances and traveling conditions are different, and can vary from one to another. I mean, my case can be very different from yours, and sorry as I cannot tell where I reside at the moment.

    I managed to secure another citizenship. I have had some good friends (through old connections) who kindly hosted me for the first few months. I have a college degree. I spent countless on-line hours hunting for jobs in my major (been jobless for over three months when first arrived). I have moved between different countries looking for a good fit.

    To me, your plan sounds like a suicide plan. I never been into Iraq and not sure how things are there nowadays. I assume you’ve been in military and already knew the area. And; IMHO, I don’t think Syria or the Turkish borders are good options; especially with all refugee camps and military conflicts.

    I can tell you that, It won’t be easy, you’ll struggle at first but once you fit in, everything will be good.
    The questions that should be added in your homework and clearly answered in your plan are like:
    Where would I go when I first arrive?
    How long do I need to stay there?
    Do I know people in that area?
    What should I do the first 3-6 months?
    How can I look for jobs in that area?
    Is it gonna be my final destination or Am I going to move somewhere else?
    How to manage my travel needs? Is there a 2nd passport in hand? If not, How long is my current passport valid for?
    And most importantly, how to get a job? You can’t simply rely on the saving you have forever.

    I sense that you were misjudged, suffered from a complete injustice. Don’t you think this has a reason behind the seen? I’m not a religious or anything. But don’t you think everything happens for a reason, and your story has a good one? I would wonder if I were you, and start believing that there has to be a justice somewhere, and tyrannous, oppressive people cannot go away with it forever, even after death. There is no way and it doesn’t even make any sense to me.

    Anywho, Gulf area is the best I would say if you managed to get a job there (linkedIn can be a good start) Jordan (Amman) is becoming a modern city. Also, Egypt is not a bad place at all. Tunisia is very friendly. These countries always seek English speakers who has no college degree, where a job can be found in tourism, 5 star hotels, decent restaurants.. etc.

    • REPLY TO M1

      Robert smith and M1 I am very interested in speaking with you both about how you left the usa and how you are going to leave the usa.

      These are by far the best post I yet to have come across. M1 you have already left the united states of America and secured a new citizenship.

      I am in desperation right now I need this too I need guidance where to go how to get anolthner citizenship. How to find a job.

      If you’re not comfortable talking through this post for fear this bastards will hunt you down like an animal.

      We can speak through email or phone I prefer phone I have many questions to ask you.

      • CHiLd SuPpOrRt SlAvE :

        Just keep this in mind, when both posting to the Internet and using the Internet… “Loose lips, sink ships”. (it was true during WWII and it is true now)

        If you DO use the internet for research, make sure that once you’ve picked a target country, that you research other countries in the same detail, so. If and when you travel to that country, make sure to cover your tracks. For example, if you were going to settle upon Guatemala as a country to go to, you would research other countries online like Mexico, Belize, Nicaragua, etc. Then when you fly out there each time, charge a plane flight to Mexico (a larger “haystack” than Guatemala) on your credit card. Then use cash to take a bus to Guatemala. It would be even better for example, if you already had a second passport from Mexico.

        If your ex or authorities come looking for you, they would be looking in Mexico and not Guatemala. If you want to vanish, just keep in mind that a larger haystack has its advantages ( Brazil, China, India, etc) Also, language proficiency. If you are going to study languages, make sure your choices are broad (for example Arabic covers many countries, and Spanish covers many countries). You could for example study both Spanish and Portuguese, start setting up in a country bordering Brazil, and then do something like get an Investor VISA in Brazil (costs $65,000 USD)

        Also, bigger countries like Brazil and China are less likely to be intimidated by the US. In Brazil, an advantage is that it is racially diverse, with everything from blond/blues to African mixes. You won’t stick out like a sore thumb.

        Also, as a last resort, have a failsafe fall back position… in my case, the Middle East. (Spanish Sahara and Northern Iraq are two examples)

      • Well, the wife has been out and about while am at work having sex with some guy she met on Facebook. Charmingly, she went out and took the kids to the zoo (with him). Men are replaceable (but not their wallets). I did however, manage to send a text message to another guy she has been screwing mentioning to him that she is just playing him and that she is seeing some other guy now.

        I am leaving work a little early while she is out today (with the guy), to take the first step which is to get my fingerprinting done on the 258-1 Federal form, so I can turn in a 1-783 request for CJIS investigation. (I will only go to the Middle East as a fallback if primary attempt fails) My first goal is to the paperwork so I can get a residency in Latin America… the real estate there can be CHEAP and food can be had in the markets for $3/day.

  81. Years ago women were at the mercy of what their ex-husband’s wanted to pay them, now the tide has turned so drastically that we are making men pay a ridiculous amount of money for compensatory support (bullSt) in my mind, often leaving them with little to nothing for themselves. What about their lives? A colleague of mine currently is being told by his lawyer that out of a $6000 monthly take home he could be paying his ex (whose new spouse earns $185,000 year) $4500 PLUS child support per month – leaving him with $1000 month!? HELLO. Ex lives in a $700,000, takes multiple trips a year, has a horse….etc., etc. and this man lives in his parents basement. What the hell happened here?

    So my question is what can we do NOW to change the ridiculous case laws that encourage judges to uphold past mistakes? What happened to WOMEN’S INDPENDENCE? This sets back women’s liberation about 75 years.

    Ladies grow up, take responsibility for yourself.

    • Normally I look towards statistics over anecdotes, but I have heard more than enough anecdotes about women who are into horses being crazy. Not just routinely crazy, but bat s**t crazy. If you are a guy, and you are dating someone who has paintings of horses throughout the house, dinner plates and china with horses on them, don’t date them seriously, don’t plan to marry them, and double check your condoms for pin holes.

      Better yet, just back away from them slowly.

      Babyon 5 quote: “I’ll tell you one thing. If the primates that we came from had known that someday politicians would come out of the gene pool, they’d have stayed up in the trees and written evolution off as a bad idea! Hell, I always thought the opposable thumb was overrated!”

      The system profits from the ridiculous laws. You are fighting against two things: women who wield the “Ring of Gyges” to serve themselves, and the system of lawyers, courts, judges, bureaucrats that materially profits from divorce (divorce/child support industrial complex).

      You might as well have asked the Southern plantation owners to voluntarily give up their slaves. At best a few people might display a conscience, but not enough. The smart men respond with running away, rather that be put on the whipping post. Its not “morally bankrupt” to run away from a system that is morally bankrupt itself. People always expect you to fall on your sword or be “honorable”. Ever notice how in “Game of Thrones” — the most honorable people (like Ned Stark) die the soonest — trying to be “honorable” while dealing with dishonorable people is being a chump.

      Sometimes its best to just walk away from darkness, which brings to mind another quote from Babylon 5, one from the technomage to Londo. “You are touched by darkness, Ambassador. I see it as a blemish that will grow with time. I could warn you of course, but you would not listen. I could kill you, but someone would take your place. So I do the only thing I can–I go.” Neither violence nor futile attempts to reform the system will work–the system isn’t interested in listening.

      My own plan is to do the only thing *I* can… I go.

      • @Robert Smith
        The red flags that I’ve noticed in women are:

        – women with horses
        – women with more than two earrings in each ear (especially the ones with five or more)
        – women with tattoos on their faces or necks or tattoos that are bigger than a square inch anywhere else
        – women with short-short hair (defined as being as short as Donald Trump)

  82. Guys,

    I’m very interested in hearing from people who left the country, but also left their loved children behind. Were you ever able to get over the pain/guilty of leaving them? Were you able to maintain contact, even though you may have an evil ex who hates your guts? Were you able to reconnect after they grew up, maybe?

    I’m paying more than 4K per month in alimony and child support. The ex is fighting for more and I’m reaching my breaking point financially and emotionally. I already have a dual-citizenship and would have left a long time ago if it wasn’t for my two daughters. The older one has been completely brainwashed (parental alienation syndrome) and won’t even talk to me. However, the younger one still really loves my company, even though I only have her 35% of the time.

    I don’t know what’s worse: Be my ex’s slave for the next 12 years, or leave my children behind…

    • Well if the younger one is 6, I would think she doesn’t yet possess enough language skills for parental alienation syndrome to be a factor… yet. The operative word being here is “yet”. I would expect your ex to eventually turn the 6 year old against you (she has years to work on that). In this society, your children aren’t really yours… men are just sperm donors (except with strings attached), operating at the whim of whether or not the “wife” wants to leave you for the bigger, better deal. I’m telling my 17-yr old son to stay single and if he ever wants a kid, to save up the money for surrogacy ($100,000 to $150,000) or adopt… if he can’t afford that, he can’t afford marriage and divorce, either. Best damn lesson I’ve ever taught him.

      Face the fact that you live in a society that only values you as a piggybank and not as a person, and that extends to the legal system and women. (Just look at how the US government goes after Americans working overseas for taxes, even dual citizenship people, with nothing to do with divorce or child support … constant “rent-seeking” behavior — and the hilarity of it is fiscal irresponsibility to the tune of $205 trillion in unfunded liabilities)

      Neitzche said that “he who fights dragons long enough, becomes a dragon”. The US fought against the USSR in the Cold War for nearly 5 decades. I remember being a teenager and hearing Ronald Reagan describing the USSR as an evil empire. The US fought an evil empire long enough to become an evil empire itself. (Just look at how even the police look like storm troopers, with armored vehicles, etc)

      The smart thing to do is to realize what the US has become, find a way out, and then leave. (since you have dual citizenship, renounce your US citizenship at the US embassy in that country, there is a Federal form to fill out and a $300 charge. (see, they even get you on the way out!)

    • Also, do your research… some countries (not that many) have reciprocal child support arrangement agreements with the US, mostly (but a few non-) European countries.

  83. My 13-year old has been fully brainwashed with PAS and won’t even talk to me. However, my 9-year old still loves coming to my house and spending time with me. As much as I would LOVE to hear that my ex is actually being forced to apply for a job after loosing her private welfare (alimony), I don’t think I would be able to get over the guilty of abandoning my daughter…

    We need more people to fight against this system. Making people decide between their freedom and their children is just too cruel!!! Some states have achieved miracles such as 50/50 custody. In Indiana, alimony cannot usually exceed 3 years! After that, the lazy $!@#$ has to work.

    • @GP

      Indiana is one those college pay states. I believe you will be forced to pay college plus CS until the age of 21 years. This assumes your kids will go to college. With greedy vindictive Exes being the way they are, you can be sure she will try to keep the money rolling in as long as possible. The CS will go to the Ex to spend as she pleases. The college pay is supposed to be split 50/50 with you and the ex. It rarely seems to be 50/50 and more like 80/20 if you are lucky

      I’ve read cases in Indiana with judges throwing in a car, gas money, insurance, rent, books, computer, cell as part of college expenses on top of the tuition and CS. It depends on the judge if he/she throws all this in

  84. I walked away from the UK divorce court, the “family” system is just as pathetic there. Faced with the prospect of not seeing my boy and being financially raped or not seeing him and having a life. I didn’t have any assets in the jurisdiction, so I just walked away.
    The system in Canada is as much a failure as it is in UK. It has failed the children miserably.
    When faced with a viscously vindictive and greedy ex, and the so obviously bias court systems I am surprised that more don’t walk out and move away.
    I put money away for my child for when he comes of age. His mother and new partner both have 6 figure incomes. My boy will be okay, but sadly wont know his Dad or the truth until he hopefully seeks it in later life.

    • Billy,

      Where you very close to your boy when you left the UK? If yes, how did you handle the pain? Also, what country did you end up going to? With the Hague convention treaties, many people are afraid of being hunted down at the new country…

      • GP,

        My boy was not yet 3 years old when I made the tough decision to exit the game. It was made easier for me I guess as my ex had denied access to my boy for one and a half years, or basically since her huge financial demands began via the courts and lawyers.
        Everyone’s story is different and in my case I had not lived in my country of birth for 15 years. I did however give up a lucrative job overseas to participate in our agreed shared care and cost of our boys upbringing and return to my country. Of course the agreement was not kept as soon as lawyers became involved and my ex found a new partner.
        At first I was in turmoil, of course I was. I think about my boy every day and wonder if I did the right thing.
        I have now moved on and live in Asia. I have a good contract, nice house, new girlfriend and we live very well. I had the full support of my family and my girl has been very supportive.
        I’m not in a country that has a REMO agreement so I will be okay for now.

  85. “$2235.00 for the children and $1537.00 for his wife.”??? Who pays that much for their kids a month and why can’t she get a job and become a productive member of society?!?

    I sympathize with the fathers in these posts as I am also in your shoes – an ex wife that only works part time, doesn’t have to pay for medical insurance for our kids (I cover it), has grandma pay for the kids extracurricular activities, doesn’t use the In-Network dentists or vision specialists, goes dancing and drinking on the weekends, receives support from me already….and now is wanting more money – three times the amount!! I have my own mortgage to pay, my own bills to pay, student loans (which I put myself through school after we were divorced), worked my way up the ranks in the IT field (after we were divorced), and yet I am being told by the OAG’s office that since I am the non-custodial parent, I am the one who has to pay. Ignore the fact that she has done nothing to change her lifestyle since her divorce but yet I have to change mine all the time to accommodate her. We are not “dead beat” dads, we are just mentally and financially abused to the point where are are backed into a corner….something is going to give eventually. This is entirely the courts fault – they are not fair nor impartial when it comes to the non-custodial parent (90% of the time that’s the father).

  86. I am a female and I am sickened by this disgusting family law court system. It is all for men and how hard to screw them. My fiancé was separated 10 years ago. This troll took him for everything. He s ordered to pay over 10,000 a month in spousal/ child support and all there activitys,cloths ect. He only can afford to pay 7000 a month which obviously leaves us broke. Because he only pays 7000 a month he has lost his licence,lost his passport we can’t buy a house or anything. He left that fat lazy troll with the house and she drives two cars and we have one car between us. He does not see his children and of course she blames it on him. It’s his fault. We have a little boy together and can barely survive,we can’t get married because she won’t divorce him and the court won’t allow the divorce until he pays the back pay. Which there is no money to pay back pay. The worst part is this stupid bitch complains to the court that she can’t survive off 7000 a month !!! There are sick people out there. My fiancé is severely depressed and hardly can function. We are thinking of leaving the province and never returning. It’s sad for the children but we have to live our lives.

    • Sounds like a very familiar story. My boyfriend is left with nothing to live on and still can’t make all of his court ordered payments. The judge ordered him to look for a better paying job rather than adjust his support payments according to what he does make, rather than working with the job he loves, that pays more than he’s ever made and is perfectly in line with his education, our part of the country and his contribution in the marriage – he was a stay at home dad so his ex could work. She’s an attorney, natch. And I, with a more advanced degree and a killer resume, only make $4 per hour more than he does, and I could never afford his child support, so I don’t know what kind of job he’s supposed to find.

      We both are pretty much living off my income AND buying clothes for the kids cuz the ex wife with her Juris Docterate doesn’t know how to pack appropriately when we have them. I’m afraid we’ll never be able to afford to have a family of our own.

    • Yep…I’m in nearly similar circumstances. Can’t afford to pay…and career destroyed by her vexacious charges. I’m trying to figure out how this person can’t live on $7000? The average Canadian Family thrives on about $3000/Month. and that is more than double! FRO and the Family Courts really need their Butts kicked swift and hard!

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